Pictures of Aborted Fetuses – They Look Human, They ARE Human


Abortion sickens me, but ‘pro-choice’ abortion suppoters who argue that ‘the aborted gunk is just blood and mucus’ or ‘an embryo or a fetus isn’t a human’ sicken me even more.

Killing a baby in a crib = MURDER

Killing a pregnant woman = DOUBLE MURDER (one for the woman, one for the unborn child)

Killing a baby in the womb = LEGAL ABORTION

WTF???!!!

If you think not-born-yet = not-human, then take a look at the following links. Even at the totally-legal-to-abort First Trimester (0 – 3 months pregnant), you can’t deny the explicit humanness of the tiny baby.

They can even survive so well, that 50 babies survive attempted abortions every year in the UK – and then if left to die, is counted as infanticide. So killed in womb = abortion, attempted kill then left to die in clinic = murder.

Take a good, long look. Puke your guts out, then come back and tell me how the following are not considered humans – living and growing, until they were murdered by abortionists.

WARNING – EVERY ONE OF THE IMAGES THROUGH THE LINKS IS HIGHLY DISTURBING – YET THEY SHOW THE REALITY OF THE 1.2 MILLION BABIES MURDERED EVERY YEAR (IN THE USA ALONE) and 1.2 MILLION BABIES MURDERED EVERY MONTH IN THE WORLD

http://amightywind.com/abortion/pleaseno.htm

Google Images

——————————–

Meanwhile, thousands of pro-life supporters marched on Washington in protest of the 35th anniversary of Roe vs Wade, which removed the human right to life of unborn babies in favour of the right of irresponsible mothers to not be emotionally annoyed.

And of course, this is how the supremely biased, lie-beral MSM portrays it, via Ryskind:

MarchForLifeMistakenID

It’s not like peaceful and dignified Walk for Lifers don’t have enough rabid, anarchic opposition already.

More cartoons:

RoeWade35AbortClinic

WishCouldHaveHadABirthday

VictimsOfRoevsWade

RoeWadeCake

NoRSVPRoeWade

BarakObamaOnViolence

AbortionSupportersWereBorn

See also:

Full Uncensored Video Footage of Abortion on Spain TV

Liberal Vampires Would Kill Millions of Stem Cell Babies to Live Longer

SCHIP and Abortion Moonbat Back-to-Square-One Argument

Liberal Definition of A ‘Person’

Back to the Future Stem Cells

Are Your Babies Inside Your Parents?

You Reach Your Right Hand In, And Pull The Baby’s Brains Out

Hey, Do You Think We Should We Kill Babies?

Are Your Babies Inside Your Parents?

Mommy Why Don’t You Love Me


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159 Responses to “Pictures of Aborted Fetuses – They Look Human, They ARE Human”

  1. Judges 11: Debunking The Myth That Jephthah Burns His Daughter As A Human Sacrifice to God « BUUUUURRRRNING HOT Says:

    [...] PPS. While Christians are accused of looking up to Biblical characters as examples of how to murder children, and are accused of hoping to murder children again some day, liberals are murdering 1.2 million babies every single month (and don’t you dare tell me that these babies aren’t human until you look at the pics via this link.) [...]

  2. Baby Names » Pictures of Aborted Fetuses - They Look Human They ARE Human … Says:

    [...] Dig deeper into the topic here [...]

  3. LYNDSEY Says:

    I LUV BABYS AND THT IS STUPID

  4. JESSICA Says:

    ABORTION IS SICK AND WOMEN WHO ABORT BABIES ARE COLD AND HEARTLESS. IF THEY DONT WANT TO FALL PREGNANT THEY SHOULD CONSIDER CONTRACEPTIVES!! MAY GOD HAVE MERCY ON THEM. THERE ARE SO MANY WOMEN IN THE WORLD WHO CANNOT HAVE BABIES AND WOMAN WHO ABORT DONT DESERVE TO BE CALLED A WOMAN BUT RATHER MURDERERS.

  5. sillygirl Says:

    killing babies is fun..everyone should try it!!

  6. Simon Thong Says:

    did you get left out when they were killing babies, sillygirl?

  7. Angelica B. Licudan Says:

    babies are gift from God..we should know how to love and appreciate them…not all the woman in the world are capable of bearing a child.. there are some who are sterrile so be thankfull to God because many are still praying to have a child but only few are the chosen one….Learn to think…love and appreciate the Product of true love…Do not ingage yourself in aborting your own flesh…coZ if you do it… you are allowing yourself to experience Rudest and Demoneous Karma create By your Leader satan…be Good ok….Goodluck…….D

  8. joanna arcaina Says:

    Wag na makipagsex kung magpapalaglag din lang…….GOODLUCK

  9. jamilla erasquin Says:

    Angelica,your opinion is really true and good but Poverty is bad. MAKE SENCE????????

  10. Scott Thong Says:

    jamilla, are you basically saying that abortion makes people richer? (Apart from the abortion clinics, of course)

  11. Syl Says:

    To really make a sensible anti-abortion argument, people have GOT to leave their Gods out of it. Everyone’s God has their list od ‘do’s and do not’s.’ I, as an agnostic, (not an atheist, there’s a difference,) cannot be swayed by someone else’s religion. Do I think abortion is a terrible decision? Yes I do. Do I think that way beacuse someone’s God says so? No, not all. I believe abortion is wrong because a human life is unique, priceless, and full of unlimited potential. People need to stop stump-speeching for their church and come up with their own intelligent arguments.
    I make this point not to attack religion, as I understand it’s value to many people and would not take that away from them.
    I make this point instead because I am passionate about life itself, and would like to see a few more pro-life debates won in favor of life, instead of seeing pro-lifers preaching fire and brimstone to people who don’t believe in hell anyway, making the pro-lifers look like religion zombies without their own thoughts.

  12. Scott Thong Says:

    Thanks for the input, Syl.

    I am determined to fight abortion in any way I can, and if you look at my other posts on the topic, you’ll find that I also attack it from the aspects of legality, humaneness, human rights and put-yourself-in-the-baby’s-shoes. Religion is just one of my attack prongs.

  13. Andrea Says:

    ilu abortion

  14. Christine P Says:

    Personally I used contraceptive both a condom and was on the pill yet i got pregnant and presently am single college student with two boys i got scared and when i told the daddy he was going to be a first time daddy we argued and stoped talking so i got scared that i couldnt give birth to yet another child were i would not have time as im in school and the way it sounded after telling him have no daddy soo being upset i told him i would abort and well he said that was for the best going there i hoped he would show up to get me and say wait don do it and as God is my witness i thought they give a mak to put you out but it was in the iv so when i thought i had time to back out it was to late i blacked out asked when i woke up and it was done and now all i do every day is cry cry cry how will my baby ever know how i wanted to not go through and love em and wish i could go back in time and carry to term to hold and kiss em please someone tell me where to go from here i didnt know that i was being out under yet HHHHEEELLLLPPPP

  15. Justin Says:

    You people are so f*cking closed minded, Dictating how other people should live there life. Shut the f*ck up worry about your own life. What about Victims of Rape? They should keep the baby just to keep your god happy right… Give me a f*cking break. Stupid religious nut jobs. God doesn’t Love you. And your religion is a rip off of bunch a peigan religions. And just for you aholes im gona be an abortionist for Halloween

  16. Scott Thong Says:

    Lololol

    Raging moonbat with arguments less formed than a week old embryo!

    I cant even be bothered to quote his words while turning them around to indict him with his own argument, which is my usual response to such splutteringly outraged unhingedness.

  17. Diana p Says:

    I personaly think that doctors are more interested in making money off abortions than anything else,usually a mom ready to give up that baby is not totally aware of the what exactly will be taking place.,maybe if they shown graphic images and know how inhumane these procedures were than they might just change there minds.not as much guilt murdering a baby in the womb i guess as appose to outside.

  18. Diana p Says:

    In reply to Justins comment,.It dosn’t have to take someone close minded to see the reality of whats the difference between a abortion because of rape or just for the mere fact its a burden to the mother,you mean there are over two million cases of rape every year,thats crazy.So whatever your reasons to justify these killings I guess only God can and will judge your heart and soul

  19. David Says:

    In reply to Justin. If a woman should have a choice about aborting her baby, then why doesn’t the baby have a choice?

    That’s whats wrong with our society today. Many have turned their faith from God. Now we have babies being killed, wars, one can’t go to church without being attacked. By who..not Christians by atheist and by those who turned their back on God.

    And to Syl leaving God out is the cause of OUR problems in homes, schools, and life. Marriages are fallen apart crime is on the rise. Did you know in the Christian community divorce is 20% less. Get it right. I Romans 1 it talks about thoise who turned their back on God. Eventually they became deceived in their ways. Turning their backs on right. Sound like whats going on today. That ws written almost 2000 years ago.

    As for Christine P. Pray there is comfort. Find you a support group. Cantact a pastor they are happy to help.

  20. Scott Thong Says:

    You wouldn’t be wrong, Diana… Planned Parenthood, the abortion-enabler supreme, the government funded using taxpayer’s money, the ‘non-profit’ organization… Made a record profit of $55 million.

  21. Change Says:

    Too bad you Jew-supremacist racist dog is not aborted.

  22. Scott Thong Says:

    Well congrats, troll who uses different IDs, you just donated more material for my collection of how Hamas supporters are utterly uncivilized.

  23. beatriz Says:

    im against abortion 2 go tha hell can do that to a poor inedefenless in one… they never kno what that lil one might became… that lil one could find a cure of something…

  24. Argentinita Says:

    Abortion is killing!!!

  25. Tina Says:

    How about you spread your legs = BABY ? I no woman in thier fortys who had an abortion that is sick !! come on now we are not talking about someone who got raped at eleven yrs old and got pregnant, they do have the morning after pill for those unfortunate to go through that and it will take care of your problem, anyone spreading thier legs 16 yrs and up no’s better, it is murder, have the child and give it to someone who wants one! I swear people are using abortion as a birth control and ya no what if you are a so called reasponsable adult like 20 and up, if you bleed to death during the murder of your child OH WELL. at least you won’t have to be burned or pulled apart limb by limb uh? I had two wonderful PLANNED children, I showed them the Movie, that is now banned “THE SILENT SCREAM” it was horrible but reality, my son has two adorable children and my daughter is planning on starting a family, both of them are very against and very responsable, so EDUCATE your children and maybe they will see it for what it really is and not a sack of grapes uh?

  26. Scott Thong Says:

    Thanks for mentioning Silent Scream… I never knew such a film existed. I’ll be blogging on that shortly.

  27. smith Says:

    it is very easy for people to judge and point fingers at others, especially when they may be the main one who choose to do nothing about it or just simply turn they back on a person in that situation and say well that is none of my business. I understand all of that,but i know alot of you have been in situations where you thought things were critical and you have done things that others thought were disgusting.I you are a man reading this i say to all of you cover,because you too have to take responsibility for your actions.Stop droping and discarding your load. Women judge not when you are in a situation like this and your are scared and alone with no support no one to turn too because when you got pregnant you became the worst person in the world, now you go and have an abortion you are a monster. People make mistakes.I am not for it or against it. I would never ever want to think that one day i may have to make a decision like that, but I hope if i am ever in this position that i can come to one of you judgemental people.

  28. Scott Thong Says:

    I agree with you – the irresponsible men who use and then abandon women are to be held just as responsible!

  29. Key Says:

    Its so funny how people are so jugdemental with one’s sins, I dont say abortion is ok, but no one is perfect, people should stop judging people and make themselves the perfectionist, God says come with your sins no matter how big or small, God can not juge you, so how come a human being living on this earth with his own sins can say to onother person you are a sinner you deserve to die or you have done this u derseve this, wheareas God can so easily forgive and accept us and not jugde us, to those who have aborted talk to God, show God you are really sorry God will forgive all your sins and forget about jugdmental people who also have their own mistakes but so quickly to jugde other sGod love us all and he is the only jugde

  30. Scott Thong Says:

    so how come a human being living on this earth with his own sins can say to onother person you are a sinner you deserve to die or you have done this u derseve this

    So how come a pregnant couple living on this earth with their own bad choices can say to their baby, you are a mistake and a burden you deserve to die?

    Abortion is the Con-Choice

  31. christi Says:

    Gosh I can’t believe what this world has come to.I am currently 20weeks pregnant with my 3rd baby boy.we can judge all we want to but the truth is there’s still gonna be abortions.people who abort precious babies will have to answer to god one day.people who support abortions really are sick.do yall know what they do to the babies? They rip them apart like there trash.its so sad and selfish!!!may god bless the lil babies that are lost.

  32. Nasaei Ahmad Says:

    That satanic acts happen in all communities. Perhaps in animal kingdom is better – they do not kill their babies like we do.

    The root cause of problem could be related to relegion I think. A religion taught that you can only marry one wife..but alas..many of its followers keep ouside marriage relationship however, especially in the West. Those
    do not want to have outside marriage babies..so what did they do ? KILL the fetus ! (We called it “abortion”).

    Though I admit this cruelty happens in many societies of any given religion, the very fact is that, it LESS happened in Islamic soceity because
    Muslim know that having outside relationship with women other than one’s own wife is a great sin. In other word, ‘womanizing”, “socializing” is very bad in the eyes of Islamic teaching and all it followers must avoid. Free sex in rampant in the West.. can anyone refute this? So the root of the problem is lifestyle which is NOT according to the teaching of the religion.
    You have illicit sex with illegal women, then you do not want the baby! How satanic your are.. and your religion does not condemn in a clear or steadfast manner..even you are proud of your “modern” (you called “modern) western lifestyle!! You even have it ‘recorded’ in your “holy” scripture! What holy ? You mistaken it to be “holy” too?..because in your admired scripture also available such acts??

    In Islam, such a lifestyle is condemned to death.

  33. Scott Thong Says:

    But, are the people in the West religious, or do they mostly follow secular humanism? (Whatever seems good for humans is right,

    Theological religion of all sorts is under attack by liberalism, especially Christianity.

    US Conservatives have been fighting against lax pro-abortion laws for decades, but now a very Liberal President with a 100% pro-abortion rating has been elected.

  34. Adifferentview Says:

    Nasaei Ahmad.If illicit sex is less common in Muslim society, how do you account for the almost daily reports of raids carried out by Luslim religious bodies throughout towns and cities in Malaysia, known as khalwat raids?

  35. Geofrey A Says:

    All what i can say is abortion is murder,there is no difference between some one who wakes up a certain morning & stubs/knives his friend because he/she owes him a great deal of money.
    Abortion is SIN !
    The wages of SIN is DEATH .
    I advice you people who have not yet aborted and would want to do so;
    You can NEVER LEAVE a happy Life after these act .
    Your going to find your self living in Fear,gilt,self condemnation,nightmares
    till you die and then face the Creater of that baby you killed .
    It ll be sad news anyway.

  36. Mer Says:

    Below is the process of abortion if this doesnt change your mind then God be with you.

    The clip begins with an ultrasound of the fetus (girl) who is about to be aborted. The girl is moving in the womb; displays a heartbeat of 140 per minute; and is at times sucking her thumb.

    As the abortionist’s suction tip begins to invade the womb, the child rears and moves violently in an attempt to avoid the instrument. Her mouth is visibly open in a “silent scream.” The child’s heart rate speeds up dramatically (to 200 beats per minute) as she senses aggression. She moves violently away in a pathetic attempt to escape the instrument.

    The abortionist’s suction tip begins to rip the baby’s limbs from its body, ultimately leaving only her head in the uterus (too large to be pulled from the uterus in one piece). The abortionist attempts to crush her head with his forceps, allowing it to be removed.

  37. Chereli Says:

    ****no comment!!

  38. chloe Says:

    i would just like to say i am a 15 and when i was 13 i became pregant and i was devasted i decided to have a termation when i was 12 weeks gone i felt so guilty afterwards i decided to read up on abortion and was shocked to read how they do its hard to think my baby would be 2 now i was shocked to hear how they dispose of the babies i have completely changed my mind on abortion and would have never had it done if i new what they did i am now 7 ouths pregant with a baby girl and am very excited

  39. Scott Thong Says:

    Thanks for your testimony chloe… The two best ways to discourage abortion are to tell others of your experience and regret, and to show them exactly what is being aborted – a tiny human being.

  40. Love Says:

    I am sad to see all of the harsh comments from both sides of this debate about abortion. We have to keep in mind that what we are reading is biased information. People against abortion are saying cruel things about the people for it and visa versa. It is sad that it always has to come to that. People kill people who have or provide abortions because they see aborting as murder, yet they are murdering aswell. I believe that one can’t fully understand something, especially the decision of having or not having an abortion, untill it happens to them or someone close to them. People love to get involved in everyone elses business, and that should not be the case, especially with something as personal as abortion.

  41. Scott Thong Says:

    People kill people who have or provide abortions because they see aborting as murder, yet they are murdering aswell.

    Love, please get your facts straight before proceeding any further.

    Number of abortionists murdered from 1973 to 2008: Seven.

    Number of registered abortions from 1973 to 2008: About 519 million (1.2 million per month).

    There is absolutely no comparison between babies killed and the people who kill them.

  42. Nora Says:

    Oh please everyone needs to stfu about abortions. No offense, and I do not mean to be rude, but I am respectful to my Lord, but I know this is more just a religious issue, so mentioning God isn’t going to help everyone agree.

    If abortion is legal, great! <- Sarcasm. People can go get ones as much as they want.. just get out of peoples' lives and stop caring about what other people do. You have to realize murder and death happens all the time, and if someone takes the life of someone else, it's not your knowledge of why it happened. If everyone here believes in God, then you should know He takes lives and gives life. So if you're not born yet and your life is taken, I guess you just got your way up to heaven a bit earlier? In this case you won't have to worry about your "sins" the second you are born.

    If abortion is illegal, then all the pro-life people can just wave and be like YAY we got that accomplished, now what? Oh wait, I guess we won't be "seeing" murdered "babies" anymore, besides the "hideous" abortion images that are left, thinking that there is supposed to be a cleaner way to do this procedure?? What now? Are you still going to post the OBVIOUS sickening images of blood and guts that everyone is already tired of seeing? Because it hasn't persuaded me enough to stop abortion, even though I would never get one. Of course you easily get through to people by showing pictures, what else? If it's so gross, then state a cleaner way of getting an abortion. Oh wait, there isn't one so far!

    And all you tough tough tough women (I'm a female too, by the way) were working your butts of getting your voting rights, your rights to work and be equal to men and now you're pro-life and see pro-CHOICE as something wrong. I guess it's not a choice, so if it's not a choice, then where is your right as a woman?

    God damn you people.. just leave the issue alone.. If people die from abortions, their problem right? Have we moped about their deaths? No because all you jerks probably go "well she deserved it because she murdered a baby!" Well, she died!! She's life too, don't you give a hoot about her?? What if she lived and got pregnant again but didn't have an abortion this time? She still died, I don't give a F whether she was innocent or not.. because to me, she didn't murder. i don't know what you guys think.

    Just leave the abortion legal, let the idiots/irresponsible or unhealthy females get them, and everyone else.. MYOB. I don't dictate the amount of children you have, you don't talk to me about mine. You guys are such nosey people.

    And you would think people like Nadya Suleman are the reasons why abortions should be legal. I will go to jail before I give a single penny to famewh*res like that, and she even said she wants to have more children! Leeching my hard working cash for her stupidity and children that she created by herself, not from God.

    This issue was a long time ago. If people still complain about this, then you guys have issues.. just leave it alone and it'll stop bothering you eventually.

  43. Scott Thong Says:

    If abortion is illegal, then all the pro-life people can just wave and be like YAY we got that accomplished, now what?

    Straw man argument.

    Our position (well, for most of us anyway) is not to de-legalize abortion. It is merely to restrict it to life-threatening cases or extenuating circumstances such as rape, pedophilia or incest. At present due to Roe v. Wade, emotional distress is enough justification for an abortion. The subjectivity of this term means that 1.2 million American women every year kill their babies because the thought of being a mother makes them uncomfortable, or they are upset they don’t know who the dad is, or some other totally life threatening reason.

    Oh wait, I guess we won’t be “seeing” murdered “babies” anymore, besides the “hideous” abortion images that are left, thinking that there is supposed to be a cleaner way to do this procedure?? What now? Are you still going to post the OBVIOUS sickening images of blood and guts that everyone is already tired of seeing?

    Once abortions are put in their proper place (i.e. emergencies only), pro-life groups would have as much reason to continue pointing out the gruesome reality of abortions as Greenpeace has reason today to preserve fire ants from extinction.

    And all you tough tough tough women (I’m a female too, by the way) were working your butts of getting your voting rights, your rights to work and be equal to men and now you’re pro-life and see pro-CHOICE as something wrong. I guess it’s not a choice, so if it’s not a choice, then where is your right as a woman?

    If abortion is all about women’s CHOICE, then why did a feminist group protest that Superbowl ad for doing nothing more than telling women they can CHOOSE to keep their baby? Or are women only supposed to CHOOSE abortion, and choosing to keep the baby becomes MALE CHAUVANISM?

    And as I said elsewhere, what about the baby’s right to choose? Especially if it’s a baby girl?

    Or didn’t you know that abortion in China and elsewhere is the number 1 killer of girls?

    Until the 1980s people in poor countries could do little about this preference: before birth, nature took its course. But in that decade, ultrasound scanning and other methods of detecting the sex of a child before birth began to make their appearance… Parents who wanted a son, but balked at killing baby daughters, chose abortion in their millions.

    Didn’t think of that angle, did you? That if women are free to abort their babies on a whim, their whim might be to abort only baby girls?

    Or blacks?

    Black women account for 6% of the population but 56% of abortions.

    Honestly, with all those free condoms being handed out to kindergarteners, can’t you people just use one?

    Or hey, stop sleeping around and save us all most of the headache of abortions, STDs, single parent homes, teenage mothers and HIV/AIDS!

    God damn you people..

    Uh, what happened to No offense, and I do not mean to be rude, but I am respectful to my Lord?

    Just leave the abortion legal, let the idiots/irresponsible or unhealthy females get them, and everyone else.. MYOB. I don’t dictate the amount of children you have, you don’t talk to me about mine. You guys are such nosey people.

    Sure thing! Next let’s also ask Hiro Nakamura to take us back to 1939 and tell nosey old Roosevelt to MYOB don’t dictate to Hitler how many Jews he gasses, just go smack the Japs around some (except Hiro, of course).

    And you would think people like Nadya Suleman are the reasons why abortions should be legal. I will go to jail before I give a single penny to famewh*res like that, and she even said she wants to have more children! Leeching my hard working cash for her stupidity and children that she created by herself, not from God.

    Wait, didn’t you just say don’t dictate the amount of children you have, you don’t talk to me about mine? So that means it’s all good with my anti-death blogging and I can continue now, right?

    Your citing Nadya Suleman is about as fair an attack on pro-lifers as me citing Aliza Shvarts as representative of pro-deathers. Actually, me citing Shvarts is probably closer to accurate.

    Btw, you have an odd syncretism of anti-life (liberal) and anti-welfare parasite (conservative) views.

    This issue was a long time ago. If people still complain about this, then you guys have issues.. just leave it alone and it’ll stop bothering you eventually.

    Sure thing! So can we also drop the whole gay marriage issue for good since it’s been decided by voters several times over? Can all those anti-Prop 8 guys with issues please go home now?

  44. Nasaei Ahmad Says:

    Unspeakble…, so heinous for human beings to kill their offsprings..the result of illegal, illicit sexual relationship that they made it legal (by mutual consent/ consensus); as the result of “god is love” (abuse interpretation)…as the result of “love one another (another abuse wrong interpretation?)

    And..maybe as the result of scripture (they said..”you know..many incidences of porno, incests in the scripture as well… “nothing wrong with it !” as long as you consent it !

    And..as the result of “mary one only” policy (mary one onely, keep 2 or three, or four more secret relationship like Woods were doing, like John Terry were doin..like..many men in the West were doing..!

    Terrible, horrible..indeed. They killed millions og babies / fetuses every year. (in Malaysia maybe hundres or more as well..)

    Clearly animal kingdom, animal society didn’t do such crime. Animal is better?

  45. Your mom Says:

    I don’t necessarily think abortion is murder. Sure, cells are alive, just like cancer cells are alive.

    However, I do not care whether abortion is murder or not. There are too many f*cking people in this world and I hate babies anyway. I wish they would all die.

    And to circumvent what you are going to say, I know I was a baby once. I wish repeatedly that my mom would have aborted me, too.

  46. Scott Thong Says:

    You do realize you can still ‘self abort’, right? But what makes you think every other baby in the world would similarly want to be aborted?

    I would explain why there is a fundamental difference between ordinary cells and a developing embryo, but I figure you’re just here to make a scene.

  47. Emily Says:

    Abortion sickens me too! What sickens me even more is to know Obama voted for abortion and if the babies (fetuses to pro-choice people) survive the abortion to just leave them to die!

  48. Emily Says:

    I also think people who believe in abortion should realize that what if they were aborted? Don’t you pro-lifers?

  49. Scott Thong Says:

    I’ve noticed that everybody that is for abortion has already been born. – Ronald Reagan

  50. The PASS girl.. Says:

    Hi everyone…
    Well I just wanted to comment on some of the things above…
    I had an abortion in august 2009 and it was the biggest mistake of my life.. I don´t want anyone to feel sorry for me that´s not why I am writing this I simply want you to see a differnt site to abortion.. I read above in Jessicas post that women that have had an abortion are murders and I understand the hate and in some way I agree..
    What I did was WRONG and every sekund of the day I think of that small life that could have been with me today… I should have loved my child but I was sooo scared..
    My boyfriend did´nt want the baby and everyone around told me that abortion was the best thing to do… Everytime I had some hope someone took it away.. My boyfriend would say “we don´t have the money” “we can´t move!” and others would tell me “how will you finish school?”…
    I was afraid and as stupid as I was I wanted to please my boyfriend´s wish of not being a father yet instead of think of the baby…
    Up untill and the day I had my abortion I was living like a mummy.. telling myself not to feel love…
    After the abortion it was like reality hit me.. I realized what I had done.. I just cried and screamed asking God to please give me another chance.. to please let me have my baby back…
    Everyone tell´s me that I will have another chance… but they don´t understand that it´s not about ME having another chance… It´s about the fetus that wont have another chance.. I can get pregnant 1000 times but I´m never going to be able to make things right again…
    I wish and hope that the fetus that I had will move on to another and have a mother that will give it all the things I did´nt.. Love and protection.. Today I´m living with something called PASS (past abortion stress syndrom) and I guess I just want you to know that there are women out there who grief over their desition and that some women are pushed into abortion and just to scared to say “no I´m not doing this!! and you can´t make me”.. that doe´nt make it right but I just want you to know.. My boyfriend now also regrets.. We have seen some pictures of what the docters told us was nothing and I now know that it is.. I do think that if the docters had told us that the fetus besides having a heart.. that it had eyes, a head, fingers, a lever and so on that my boyfriend would not have told me that he did´nt want it..
    I do understand that some of you think of us as monsters (I do aswell some times).. Just know that even though 9 out of 10 women go on with their lives as nothing have happened there is that 1 girl who feels like a monster for what she has done! I deeply regret my desition and I only hope that my baby and God will forgive me one day..
    From the PASS girl.

  51. Scott Thong Says:

    PASS girl, you know what?

    You’re already forgiven! Now just give your life for Jesua and live your life to please God, and one day you will reunited with your baby in heaven.

  52. The PASS girl Says:

    Hi Scott Thong.. Thanks for the kind words.. The thing about seeing my baby in heaven really brought a tear to my eye…
    I´m not a deeply religious person but stille I am a Christian.. I truly have to believe that my baby is still out there because thinking that now it is just dead and that´s that!! that is just to painfull…
    I have learned from what I have done and I hope that telling my story to others will make them think twice before they make the same mistake..

  53. friend... :) Says:

    Dear , THE PASS GIRL and CRISTINE P.. I read your story and can relate to you.I know that alot of people say that to stop briging god and their religious belives into the subject of abortion,but the fact is that thats where it all starts…I know you feel guilty and regret what you did ,because you did it whithout knowing how your baby was formed, Im pretty sure if you did you wouldnt have done it.Im not a jehovas witness but im receving a bible study from them. Im pretty sure they could help you and give you some comfort. they are really nice people and wont judge you,but help you..when i was 14 yrs.old I got pregnant..my fathers baby was happy,he would go see me and all of a sudden he told me heres a check go get an abortion.When he told me this i knew that he didnt really love me. This made me fall into a deep depression, because mi mom didnt know i was pregnant and felt alone,hopeless and scared..So I decided to go get an abortion,but once i was there I regreted what I was doing.I thought its not mi babys fault for mi own actions,she deserves to live so i decided to have her. Now shes 5yrs old, I love her so much that I wouldnt trade her for anything.I decided to have my child I knew what i was getting myself into. You know its hard work,alot of people make the choice of having an abortion because of money issues but trust me any parent that loves their child would do anything to support their baby even if it mean recycling cans.This is a bible text that shows what would happen to alot of people in what is called the last days…MATTHEW 24:12…”And because of the increasing of lawlessness the love of the greater number will cool off.”..This means that the love of the humanity would cool off.Thats why there are people who dont belive in god which leads to such violence and hattred and cruel world that we are living in now.And people that dont value life….These are the changes that god promises to bring on earth…REVELATION 21:4..”He will wipe out every tear from their eyes,and death will be no more,neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore.”…ISAIAH 35:6..”The lame one will climb just as a stag does.”It referes to people with disabilities…ISAIAH 35:5..”The eyes of the blind ones will be opened.”…PSALM 72:16..”There will come to be plenty of grain on earth.”This means that no one will go hungry..Heres some confort for you and me which suffer psycological dissorders because i suffer from depression…ISAIAH 33:24″No resident will say:’I am sick.”..another way that god loves us, I hope this will comfort you,about having hope in seeing your baby one day…JOHN 5:28,29..”All those in the memorial tombs will…come out.”God jehova promises ressurection and I know if you trust in him youll see your baby one day…Heres a text that shows that god has a name PSALMS 83:18..”That people may know that you,whose name is Jehova,you alone are the most high over all the earth… Im not writting this in order to offend anyone,this are just my personal belives and what the bible really teaches and respect you all.of all the messages i read your story THE PASS GIRL
    and CRISTINE P.’s story realy touched me and really care of how you are feeling.. I dont know you 2 but I hope that my story and these bible texts will comfort your pain that you went through and are still probably feeling… sincerely,a friend,..hope that one day you find inner peace

  54. Ron Says:

    Examples of God’s love for children:

    Psalms 137:9 “Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.”

    Hosea 13:16 “The people of Samaria must bear the consequences of their guilt because they rebelled against their God. hey will be killed by an invading army, their little ones dashed to death against the ground, their pregnant women ripped open by swords.”

    2 Kings 2:23-24 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. “Go on up, you baldhead!” they said. “Go on up, you baldhead!” He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youths.

    1 Samuel 15:2-3 “Thus says the LORD of hosts, ‘I will punish Amalek (A)for what he did to Israel, how he set himself against him on the way while he was coming up from Egypt. ‘Now go and strike Amalek and (B)utterly destroy all that he has, and do not spare him; but put to death both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.'”

    Ezekiel 9:5-7 Then I heard the Lord say to the other men, “Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all—old and young, girls and women and little children. But do not touch anyone with the mark. Begin right here at the Temple.” So they began by killing the seventy leaders. “Defile the Temple!” the Lord commanded. “Fill its courtyards with corpses. Go!” So they went and began killing throughout the city.

    When you march up to attack a city, make its people an offer of peace. 11 If they accept and open their gates, all the people in it shall be subject to forced labor and shall work for you. 12 If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city. 13 When the LORD your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. 14 As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the LORD your God gives you from your enemies. 15 This is how you are to treat all the cities that are at a distance from you and do not belong to the nations nearby.

    Deuteronomy 20: 16 However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. 17 Completely destroy [a] them—the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites—as the LORD your God has commanded you.

  55. Simon Thong Says:

    Ron has no idea what is or isn’t appropriate. When what is required is a word of comfort, he offers criticism. When young women are going through the grief process, and may find support from a loving God, he tries to undermine them. What does he care about? Not their feelings. Only about getting his view across. He claims to have been a believer in Christ, and that he has lost faith, and is contented to be an atheist. He doesn’t come across as contented. He comes across as savage and ferocious, especially in his attacks of others. There are other sites on this blog for hios attacks, and he knows: he has gone to many of them with his destructive negativism. If anyone wants an example of an extremist atheistic nitpicker, look no further. You have found him: he is Ron.

  56. Scott Thong Says:

    I won’t bother to answer Ron’s citations this time, but to paraphrase Moonbattery: Doesn’t a comment like this make you totally believe he has become an atheist out of a thoughtful conclusion that the preponderance of evidence weighs against the existence of a Deity, and not because he bears a childish grudge against people of faith?

  57. Ron Says:

    Hey, don’t shoot the messenger for pointing out your beloved deity is a capricious bastard who revels in genocide, infanticide, slavery, and the subjugation of women.

  58. The PASS girl Says:

    Hey friend… :)
    Thanks for giving me something to think about and also all your kind words… You are totaly right.. if I had seen what the fetus looked like.. that it was´nt just nothing, like the docters said, I would not have done it… but still I think that is why I´m having sutch a hard time with myself because eventhough I did not know how the fetus looked like I knew it was alive and that it was MY CHILD.. but still I did it to please my boyfriend and because I was scared…
    Like you I´m having a hard time beliving that my boyfriend loves me… how could he when he told me he did´nt want the life that was inside of me.. the child I thought we made out of love… I know he says he is sorry now and he says that if he could he would bring or baby back… but how can I truly believe in that? how will I ever know that if I got pregnant right now again that he would not do and say the same thing? I still love him sooooo much but at the same time it´s like my trust in him when he told me that he would never let anyone or anything hurt me is all gorn… I look at him and I see another man… It is so terrible because I want to love him the same way I once did and I want or baby back but I´m afraid none of the things wont ever happen…
    About jehovas witness .. well I respect their faith but there are so many things I don´t agree with them on.. but still thanks for giving me some idears on what to do that´s really sweet of you..
    I have worked as a church singer so I know some priests that are really sweet and I have thought of talking to them… They know who I am and I think that maybe I can find some comfort in talking to then..
    Thanks again friend… :)
    The PASS girl…

  59. friend... :) Says:

    This is the greatest example that we are living in the last days…this is a prophecy thats coming true right now..MATTHEW 24:7-8..7″for nation will rise against nation and kingdom against kingdom and there will be food shortages and earthquakes in one place after another..8″All this things are a beginning of pangs of disstres..This, if you notice its happening recently…
    MATTHEW 24:22..”In fact,unless these days were cut short,no flesh would be saved;but on account of the chosen ones these days will be cut short.” If you noticed that in the news they said that the days had been cut short as a result of all the earthquakes…This is something to think about.THE PASS GIRL … If you love your boy friend stay with him and try to trust him again, because a relationship without trust wont work because the relationship between a cuple is ALL based on trust…I know its hard, but if you really love him it will work out..first thing to do is forgive each other and start over..dont linger in the past i know you BOTH made a mistake and if you linger in the past you wont be able to find hapiness..recently i was having problems with my boyfried…By the way the person that im with its not my daughters father.I got married and had another baby , so now i have 2 beautifull girls..but we were having alot of problems..and it was because i have trust issues and that was always the problem but i know i have this problem because i had been hurt in the past…its costing me alot of work but im lerning to trust him again.. you also have to forgive your self..remember god already forgave you now you have to forgive yourself in order to forgive your boy friend i could feel that you have alot of recentment towards him,but we cant expect perfection because we are not perfect so forgive him…if you put god in first place in anything he will help you..
    sincerely..a friend.

  60. The PASS girl Says:

    Hi friend… :)..
    I know your right.. It´s really hard but I know that´s what I have to do.. Seeing in on writing and from another person really helped so thanks :)
    The PASS girl…

  61. Simon Thong Says:

    Ron, you’re no messenger but a heartless, cruel excuse for an atheist. I know some atheists and they care. They know when to emphatize, when to refrain from criticism, when to give support and encouragement. Why don’t you take your comments to other posts on this blog? Leave the comforters and encouragers to their work…

  62. Scott Thong Says:

    Hey, don’t shoot the messenger for pointing out your beloved deity is a capricious bastard who revels in genocide, infanticide, slavery, and the subjugation of women. – Ron

    I could answer each one in details specific to each case, but here’s what I always think when people polemicize about the conquest of Canaan by the Israelites – what’s the big deal, dawg?

    If the Canaanite tribes were wiped out by a meteorite – women and children included – would critics be making as much of a ruckus? I mean, it’s still God doing the smiting. How come I never hear the total destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah cited outside of discussions about homosexuality? God was pretty mean to kill em all off then too, doncha think?

    Oh yeah, no thanks offered to God for giving us life and the chance to engage in our pursuit of happiness in the first place for no money down, but when He takes back His dues – God is teh evuuulz!!!!.

    It’s just like that old, old episode of South Park where Chef shares his idea that God gives us lollipops only to snatch them away and make us cry, because we would never appreciate having free lollipops in the first place otherwise. In fact, that kind of attitude is so liberal – just like welfare parasites subsisting on the state’s charity who whine when their totally un-earned benefits are reduced.

    Here’s a comic for ya that illustrates btw.

    The bottom line when deciding whether taking a life (murder, abortion, etc.) is right or wrong is this – did you bring that life into existence and do you own the rights to that life? God does, and He gives and takes away. Deal with it.

    What’s your excuse?

  63. Scott Thong Says:

    There are actually three people in a relationship if you want it to work… You, your partner, and Jesus Christ!

    Without the selfless love, forgiveness, and putting the other above yourself that Jesus exemplifies, it’s much harder to make a marriage work. Even when only one side follows Jesus’ example, it’s still hard – hence Paul’s warning against being ‘unequally yoked’ (since one side will be doing most of the work).

    And of course, if you want to be strict about it, sexual activity should be saved for marriage.

    Maybe that’s the real test there. Does he love you enough to want to spend the rest of his life with you and only you? Does he value you enough to be willing to work hard through any future difficulties and disagreements and stick with you till death do you part?

    If he really does think you’re the best, I don’t see any reason for him not to marry you. Just IMHO.

  64. Ron Says:

    Comforters, eh? This topic opens with the words “abortion sickens me”, equates everyone involved as “murderers”, and gets filed under the tags: “baby killer” and “child murder.”

    So tell me, who’s the one really passing judgement?

  65. Simon Thong Says:

    Still trying to justify your inappropriate, cruel, heartless comments? A young woman seeks comfort, solace, encouragement, understanding and faith. She’s still going through her grief process. A fellow traveller empathizes with her and shares her faith….What did you do? Pour cold water on words of encouragement. Envious that she might find help from God, the God you turned away from, afraid that her little faith might growt into strong faith, what did you do? Tried to put out her little flame of hope. I pity anyone seeking encouraging words from you. What would they get? A hammer blow, extra nails in their casket and a pool of concrete for their burial plot.

  66. Ron Says:

    FYI, I wasn’t addressing the previous respondents. But if posting Bible verses is all it takes to extinguish someone’s faith in a cruel and sadistic deity, I’m doing them a favor.

  67. friend... :) Says:

    the bible is the most perfect book ever made and still is the book that has been the most published.. im not trying to offend any one but i think of this…1#alot of people that live by the bibles principles save themselves alot of problems…for example if i had known what i know now about staying abstinent until marrige i could tell you the truth i would have waited because to begin with i lost my virginity to a guy that wasnt worth it and now that im married iwould have wanted to share that with my husband wich comes back to what i was talking about in the begining about how the bible benifits us if we follow and live our life how gods wants us to not how you want to..this doesnt mean you have to live like a prisoner because god wants us to be happy…2#i think alot of people can relate that the bible helps in alot of ways…cuz i can tell u honestly it has helped me alot..you know what scott is right because…well the way that jehovas witness see it is that..jehova,jesuscrist,the man , the woman,…when we pray we pray to jehova but when we end our prayer we say in the name of jesuscrist amen..we end our prayer like this because jesuscrist is the one that takes our prayers to jehova…because as you can see no one can pray without going trough jesus first..hes the messanger the one that takes our prayer to god…that show to live life to put god first

  68. Simon Thong Says:

    amen, friend…:) As for Ron, he hates what believers have coz he doesn’t have it. He once had it but lost it. How did he lose it? I surmise that it is thro his intellectual pride. It is said that your worst enemy used to be your best friend, and how true that is. The worst anti-believer is an ex-believer.

  69. Scott Thong Says:

    Well, okay friend… :)

    But for myself, I believe we pray ‘in the name of Jesus Christn amen’ because Jesus is God in the flesh, as well as the Messiah and the Son of God.

    Quick reasoning from the Bible for why I believe that:

    1. Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. – Mark 12:29 (spoken by Jesus). This confirms that there is only one God.

    2. Do not worship any other god, for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God. – Exodus 34:14 (spoken by God). This confirms that only God can be worshiped.

    3. Suddenly Jesus met them. “Greetings,” he said. They came to him, clasped his feet and worshiped him. – Matthew 28:9. Jesus let people worship Him without rebuking them.

    Only God can be worshiped, but Jesus let people worship Him. Therefore, that means that Jesus must have considered Himself God. And since there is only one God, that means Jesus = God (not polytheism).

  70. friend... :) Says:

    in MATTHEW it says something different..look what it says…MATTHEW 26:39..”And going a little way forward,he fell upon his face,praying and saying:”My father,if it is possible, let this cup pass away from me.Yet,not as i will, but as you will…this is proff that jesus is not god if he was then who was he talking to…JOHN 3:16 ..”For god loved the world so much that he gave his only begotten son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life…god jehova sent his son as sacrifice..look wath it continues saying in…JOHN 3:17…”For god sent forth his son into the world, not for him to judge the world, but for the world to be saved through him…wich also shows that god jehova sent him..look at what it says in ..JOHN 8:17,18.. 17, “Also,In your own law it is written,’The witness of two men is true.’18,I am one that bears witness about myself,and the Father who sent me bears witness about me.”…then who sent jesus, jehova sent him.

  71. Scott Thong Says:

    Yes, so Jesus is not the same person as The Father. Yet, Jesus allowed people to worship Him – isn’t this wrong, unless Jesus is also God?

    How do we reconcile this? The Trinity is the only explanation – that The Father, The Son and the Holy Spirit are three, yet one. They are all considered God, but God is all three – not just one of them.

    Compare with real life. Length is considered ‘space’. Height is considered ‘space’. Depth is considered ‘space’. But what is space? Space is not just length, or just height, or just depth. Space is all three together.

    So it is with God (according to my beliefs anyway). The Father is considered ‘God’. Jesus the Son is considered ‘God’. The Holy Spirit is considered ‘God’. But what is God? God proper is not just The Father, or just Jesus the Son, or just the Holy Spirit, God is all three together.

    (It’s not as impossible as it might seem – see these other real life examples of where 2=1 and 3=1 are accepted as science.)

    Here’s an interesting verse to ponder. In the Old Testament, God gives a prophecy where He equates Himself to ‘the one they have pierced’ (i.e. crucifixion, compare Isaiah 53:5) and refers to Himself as both ‘me’ and ‘him’ in the same sentence.

    “And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son. – Zechariah 12:10

    Got that? God Himself, in the Old Testament, tells us that God will be Himself and also be someone else at the same time while being crucified. If that isn’t a description of the Trinity doctrine, what is it then?

    If Jesus is not God but only the Messiah, that’s the Jehovah’s Witness view.

    If Jesus = God the Father with no difference at all, that’s the view of Oneness Pentecostalism.

    If Jesus is God but at the same time distinct from The Father, that’s the Trinity view. (With the Holy Spirit added in of course.)

    There are many other reasons that convince me that Jesus is God (but not the same as The Father), which is why I believe in the Trinity. But I’ll stop here for now.

    Tell me what you think.

  72. friend... :) Says:

    Im going to tell you to please have an open mind to what im going to tell you…like i said in the begining im just a student if you have any more questions you could ask a jehovas witness or you can go look for information at ……..www.watchtower.org…i think youll find answers..im just learning myself

  73. Ron Says:

    My open mind tells me that:

    One God (whose laws are supposedly written unto our hearts) x
    Several billion interpretations of what those laws are =

    ONE EPIC FAIL!!

  74. Simon Thong Says:

    Atheists fail, and continue to fail. Not an epic fail but a splutter.

    Atheism = sour grapes

  75. Scott Thong Says:

    Likewise, I hope you can have an open mind too.

    I’m actually familiar with some of the Jehovah’s Witnesses beliefs and arguments, as well as those of denominations that believe that Jesus = The Father with no difference. I have my own beliefs and arguments which I’ve already shared.

    It is my own personal, honest opinion that Jesus is divine according to what I read in the Bible. I don’t just follow what some denomination ‘officially’ believes. Peter said that we are ‘priests’ now, so we have the responsibility to study and understand the Scriptures personally, not just follow what others tell us (1st Peter 2:4-9).

    For example, I do not believe that the Last Supper involved alcohol – the reason being that Jesus ate it with His disciples during Passover, a period when no yeast is allowed in any food or drink (alcoholic wine requires yeast to brew). Thus they drank non-alcoholic juice, not alcoholic wine. This is contrary to the practices of many denominations when it comes to communion. But it is my firm belief from what I read in the Bible.

    I can’t force you to think anything, but I would just like to suggest that you personally look into the Bible passages and decide for yourself – without guidance or influence from any study guides etc. – what the verses say.

  76. Ron Says:

    Re: Jesus = God???

    And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God – Mathew 19:16-17

    But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. – Mathew 24:36

    And He went a little beyond them, and fell on His face and prayed, saying, “My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me; yet not as I will, but as You will.” – Mathew 26:39

    And he withdrew himself into the wilderness, and prayed. – Luke 5:16

    (Why would he pray to himself?)

    I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me. – John 5:30

    No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. – John 1:18

    But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me. And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.John 5:36-38

    Yet we read:

    Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father? – John 14:9

    (Contradiction?)

    Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things. – John 8:28

    Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I. – John 14:28

    Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. – John 20:17

  77. Simon Thong Says:

    The scripture verses quoted by Ron refer to the Word Incarnate, God the Son in human flesh. On earth, in the flesh (as man), God the Son remains God the Son. His limitedness is a self-imposed limitedness. If the father is greater than the Son, it is again a self-imposed condition by the Son on himself as the Word Incarnate. In no way does it challenge the doctrine of the Trinity. Indeed, his scripture quotes SUPPORT the dependence of the Son on the Father during his mission as the Word made flesh.

    As always, you are selective for your own narrow purpose. For example, you quote John 1.18. Why not John 1.1-18? Because that begins with “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God.” That, of course, undermines your case.

    Btw, in John 20.17, Jesus did not say, Touch me not. He said, “Stop holding on to me.”

  78. Scott Thong Says:

    (Why would he pray to himself?) – Ron

    Trinity.

    (Contradiction?)

    YHWH and Elohim dichotomy.

    Note that God had visibly appeared as ‘the angel of the LORD’ to Old Testament characters.

  79. Simon Thong Says:

    Your quote of John 14.9 actually supports the teaching that God the father and Jesus are both God: you have seen me, so you have seen the father. That is, if you have seen me, you have seen God the father coz I am God the Son.

  80. Ron Says:

    “Trinity”

    Brevity may be the soul of wit, but not in this case. How does that address the question?

    “YHWH and Elohim dichotomy.”

    Are you aware the word “El” represents the father god of a pantheon of gods (and mankind) worshiped by the Canaanite tribes which preceded the Israelites by several centuries? Elohim is in the plural form.

    So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God. – Mark 16:19

    John is the only synoptic gospel which advances the concept that Jesus and God are one and the same. The author’s use of ‘logos’ (word) suggests his writing was influenced by Philo, a Hellenistic Jew who tried to meld Greek philosophy with ancient Judaism.

  81. Ron Says:

    “Btw, in John 20.17, Jesus did not say, Touch me not. He said, “Stop holding on to me.”

    http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%2020.17&version=KJV

  82. Simon Thong Says:

    John 20.17. The Greek is ‘mae mou haptou’ which is wrongly translated by the KJV as ‘Touch me not’. It translates into ‘Stop clinging to me’ or ‘Do not cling to me’.

    http://biblebrowser.com/john/20-17.htm

  83. Ron Says:

    mE – no
    mou – of me (me)
    haptou – be touching (be you touching)

    http://scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/NTpdf/joh20.pdf (p.4)

    And how does that change the remainder of the verse which says: “I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God” which implies that Jesus is subservient to God?

  84. Simon Thong Says:

    The concept of the Word, Logos, was not new as a concept in Jewish theology then; there was already Wisdom. The Jewish influence is undeniable. It may be claimed that Philo influenced John; was that true? Not that it matters. Why shouldn’t there be Greek influence? Christ came to all nations, Greeks included. Ideas about Logos were common in the philosophy of that period of time. John’s audience was Greek, Jews, the Greek-speaking. John was a good evangelist. He identified Jesus with the Logos, God’s Word Incarnate. That doesn’t make it Greek. It USES Greek ideas. It is uniquely John.

    John’s concept of Logos rejects Gnosticim. The Word became ‘sarx’, flesh…the word for the flesh you see hanging at meat stalls. That description is anathema to Gnostics.

  85. Simon Thong Says:

    Look carefully, Ron. haptou: be you touching: see the ‘ing’? Continuous, not Simple. Yet the translation became ‘Do not touch me’.

    And how does that change what follows? It doesn’t change it. That is Jesus, the Word Incarnate, on earth, subservient to God while on earth. It is a self-chosen subservience, part and parcelk of his sel-ichosen limitedness. Go back to John 1.1-18. That’s the Introduction. That sets the parameters within which the rest of John is to be read > In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.

  86. Simon Thong Says:

    For more on haptou

    http://www.dtl.org/bible/article/touch.htm

  87. friend... :) Says:

    In which bible text, in the bible shows the word TRINITY …?jehovas name is also…YHWH ,JHVH this is in hebrew text the name of god jehovah. These are other examples of gods name jehova:Jehovah,Yave,Yahve,Yahveh,Yahweh……….. These are some texts that show gods name..EXODUS 3:15. then god said once more to moses:”This is what you are to say to the sons of israel,’Jehovah the god of your forefathers,the god of Abraham.the god of Isaac and the god of Jacob,has sent me to you.This is my name to time indefinite, and this is the memorial of me to generation after generation. …ISAIAH 12:4..And in that day you will certainly say:”Give thanks to Jehovah, You people! Call upon his name. Make known among the peoples his dealings. Make mention that his name is put on high. …EZEKIEL 38:17,23…17,”this is what the sovereign Lord Jehovah has said,’Are you the same one of of whom I spoke in the former days by the hand of my servants the prophets of Israel, who were prophesying in those days-years-as to bring-ing you in upon them? 23,And I shall certainly magnify myself and sanctify myself and make myself known before the eyes of many nations;and they will have to know that I am jehovah.’…MALACHI 3:16 At that time those in fear of Jehova spoke with one another, each one with his companion,and Jehovah keeped paying attention and listening.And a book of remembrance began to be written up before him for those in fear of Jehovah and for those thinking upon his name. JOHN 17:26 ,[what jesus said to his father in prayer] And I [about his followers] have made your name known to them and will make it known,in order that the love with which you loved me may be in them and I in union with them. Which proffs that jesus cant be god because he was talking to him in prayer… do you know what jesuscrist name means?…this it what it means “Jehova is salvation”…

  88. Simon Thong Says:

    I’m a christian coz I see the OT from the view point of the NT. I’m not a jehovah witness, I don’t see the NT in the eyes of the OT. Trinity is not in the bible but that is not a valid argument for not accepting the word. It is a theological concept to describe the ‘God is one but three persons’ theme that runs throughout the NT, and projected back into the OT. Don’t say that is invalid. Jesus did the very same thing…”It was said that…but I say to you..”

  89. Scott Thong Says:

    In which bible text, in the bible shows the word TRINITY …? – friend… : )

    In which Bible passage do the words ‘communion’, ‘rapture’, ‘Second Coming’, ‘creatio ex nihilo’ (God creating everything from nothing), or ‘substitutionary sacrifice’ appear? Yet all of these are standard doctrine in Christianity.

    So by your argument, just because these words do not actually appear in the Bible, does this mean that we are not supposed to break bread and share wine in remembrance of Jesus? Does this mean that we will not be caught up to be with Jesus, or that Jesus will not return to the world in victory? Does this mean that God did not create the universe out of nothing? Does this mean that Jesus did not die in our place as payment for our sins?

    Of course not! Although these words – and the word ‘Trinity’ – do not appear in the Bible, the concepts behind these words are definitely there.

    The words are just helpful titles so we don’t have to say out the entire description every time. For example, we can say “They had announcements after communion” instead of “They had announcements after the breaking and sharing of bread and wine which represent the body and blood of Jesus as He instructed the Apostles during the Last Supper to eat in remembrance of Him”.

    We can say, “The Second Coming of Christ is near!” instead of “Soon Jesus will return in glory from heaven, but this is not the first time because He came to this world before in the form of a human baby about 2000 years ago and was crucified and died for our sins but came back to life and later ascended to heaven, but this time He will come in glory from heaven and everyone will be able to see and…”

    These are other examples of gods name jehova:Jehovah,Yave,Yahve,Yahveh,Yahweh

    Actually, the true and most holy name for the God of Israel is only YHVH. All others such as you cited above are merely different spellings and pronunciations. In the English translations, YHVH is translated as LORD (all capital letters).

    In order to avoid ‘taking the name of the LORD in vain’, the Jews often used the word Adonai instead, which means ‘lord’ and in English is translated Lord (only L is capital letter).

    And when focusing on ‘the God who created the universe’ instead of ‘the personal God of Israel’, the name used is Elohim – translated as God.

    This is quite clear to see in Genesis chapters 1 until 3. In Genesis 1, God (Elohim) is the term used as He creates the universe. In Genesis 2, focusing on the creation of God’s personal subjects Adam and Eve, we see LORD God (YHVH Elohim) being used. In Genesis 3, the serpent (an outsider who is not part of God’s relationships) calls Him God (Elohim). Thus we see that YHVH is used by those personally acquainted with God, while Elohim is used for God ‘in general’.

    The true name of the One God is not really an issue. Again, I must stress that The Father is not the same person as Jesus the Son. My belief is in ‘One God, in three persons’.

    EXODUS 3:15. then god said once more to moses:”This is what you are to say to the sons of israel,’Jehovah the god of your forefathers,the god of Abraham.the god of Isaac and the god of Jacob,has sent me to you.This is my name to time indefinite, and this is the memorial of me to generation after generation.

    Ah yes, a very interesting passage. Did you know that in the many English translations, this passage is translated ‘I AM has sent you’.

    And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you. – Exodus 3:14 (KJV)

    This is because YHVH literally means ‘I AM’ – that is, God is and always has been and always will be, never changing.

    Now look at how Jesus referenced this passage:

    Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM.

    Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. – John 8:58-59

    Why did they try and stone Jesus? It is because they realized Jesus was directly referencing Exodus 3:14 and using the very name of God, YHVH or I AM, for Himself!

    The punishment for blasphemy is stoning to death (Leviticus 24:15-16). The Jews realized that Jesus was equating Himself to YHVH – surely that is the strongest form of blasphemy! Thus they were ready to stone Him to death in accordance with the Laws of Moses.

    Compare again Jesus at His trial:

    The high priest said to him, “I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God.”

    “Yes, it is as you say,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.

    Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, “He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy. What do you think?”

    “He is worthy of death,” they answered. – Matthew 26:63-66 (NIV)

    Again, the charge is blasphemy. The high priest even tore his own clothes in outrage – something that Leviticus forbids:

    The high priest, the one among his brothers who has had the anointing oil poured on his head and who has been ordained to wear the priestly garments, must not let his hair become unkempt or tear his clothes. – Leviticus 21:10 (NIV)

    Thus you can see how outraged the high priest was! This is because Jesus said that He was the Messiah and the Son of Man, who will rule by God’s side according to Daniel’s vision:

    “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed. – Daniel 7:13-14

    Thus Jesus was saying He was equal to God – clear blasphemy to the Jews!

    One more example: Let’s say I steal from my brother. He can forgive me for stealing. But can he forgive the sin itself? When I stole from my brother, I rebelled against God’s commandment not to steal. Therefore my sin is against God, so only God can choose whether to forgive my sin of stealing.

    Now compare:

    When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

    Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” – Mark 2:5-7

    Again, the charge is blasphemy for equating Himself to God – for as I explained, only God can forgive sins. And yes, the paralytic’s sins were forgiven…

    But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins . . . .” He said to the paralytic, “I tell you, get up, take your mat and go home.” He got up, took his mat and walked out in full view of them all. – Mark 2:10-11

    Again, Jesus calls Himself the Son of Man, the one with authority, glory and power that only God is supposed to have – and able to forgive sins against God!

    I am Scott. If you sin against Scott, I can forgive those sins against me. Michelle cannot forgive those sins against me, because she is not Scott. Only I am Scott – only I can forgive sins against me.

    Mel Gibson is Mel Gibson. If I sin against Mel Gibson, he can forgive those sins against him. Danny Glover cannot forgive those sins against Mel Gibson, because he is not Mel Gibson. Only Mel Gibson is Mel Gibson – only he can forgive sins against him.

    Do you follow the logic?

    But if you sin against God, who can forgive that sin except God Himself? So by forgiving the paralytics’s sins – sins against God – Jesus was showing that Jesus is God.

    God is God. If a paralytics sins against God, God can forgive those sins against Him. You or I or Mel Gibson cannot forgive those sins against God, because we are not God. Only God is God – only He can forgive sins against Him. But Jesus could forgive sins against God… So that means Jesus is God.

    Do you follow the logic? The teachers of the law could, which is why they immediately accused Jesus of blasphemy for equating Himself to God!

    And there are more and more examples apart from the above. Too many times, Jesus does and says things that hint towards Him thinking He is God. Why did Jesus do and say all these things in just that manner, if He didn’t really think He Himself was God?

    In conclusion, I understand that your viewpoint may be influenced by the Jehovah’s Witnesses understanding on Scripture. I admit that my viewpoint may be influenced by Protestant/Evangelical understanding of Scripture.

    But from my own reading and reasoning, I still believe that Jesus believed Himself to be equal to God, and did and said many things to show it.

  90. sage Says:

    Fetuses are not human and abortion is cool beans.

    Also, your God is a lie.

    Bye!

  91. Simon Thong Says:

    sage? wise man” wise woman? your name is a lie.

  92. Nasaei Ahmad Says:

    John 20:17 (King James Version)

    “Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God”.

    (as given, above)..

    (off-topic). As Muslims always maintain, the word “father” is NOT refered to Jesus alone, to many other peoples as well. Bible is the proof, the fact (why needed extra interpretations for this clear-cut simple statement?

    In short, “father” is not father per se, not biological, not descendant or else, but “father” in respect and somehow metaphor. Muslim never says
    “we reject it because getting a son thru’ sexual activity/ mean..”. No !
    The fact is that God cannot begotten a son. If He is God, son is irrelevant, unless we confusely to imagine “god” to be like any of His creation – whish is a blasphemy.

    Bible recorded this (not only in that particular verse, but other)..that father is refered to other peoples as well. Does that mean we all the son of God ? Are we descendant of God ?

  93. Scott Thong Says:

    Nasaei,

    1. Jesus is not the Father, but the Son. In the context of the Trinity, Jesus respects and obeys God the Father the way a human son treats his human father.

    2. I think the Christian understanding is also ‘son not through creation/fertilization etc.’ Since Jesus is said to have existed since the very start with God the Father, our normal human understanding of how someone becomes father/son cannot apply. The closest we can understand is probably ‘son in name’ likei n adoption cases.

    3. God cannot be part of His creation because it is blasphemy applies in Islam and Judaism (hence the accusations of blasphemy and attempts at stoning when Jesus said I AM, said He can forgive sins, and said He is the Son of Man who will come in glory). However, it does not apply in Christianity. In fact, it should not apply in Judaism either, as many Messianic prophecies state that the Messiah (Christ in Greek) will be divine.

    4. Yes, many other fathers are recorded in the Bible. There are also many other sons, many others lords, many other kings, many other spirits… But we make a special distinction for God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. I suppose you could compare it to ‘Mohammad’ – there are today millions with that name, yet only one who was a prophet, correct? And when someone is referring to the one who was a prophet, you seldom confuse with – say – Mohamad Ali the boxer.

    To be honest, it would be so much easier and less confusing (and fewer criticisms!) if we could just believe that God is only God, and Jesus is just a human prophet and Messiah. But that is not what we believe the Bible says, so we cannot simply choose the easy belief simply because it is more convenient.

  94. Nasaei Ahmad Says:

    Thanks Scott. One thing I could learn from you (beside your vast Biblical knowledge..) is that you are always ‘cool’ and not easily get angry / get mad with any question outsiders sincerely posed. We should be like that..but I sometimes might be quite ‘sarcastic’ or angered..failure to stick to islamic teaching sometimes..

    However I didn’t say Jesus was God – that would be even more deviated (by Muslim understanding). I said, that particular verse stated that “father” is meant for everyones..or the others – not for Jeus alone. And that appears in some other verses as well. So, we do not understand, why Jesus alone is called “Son of God” and not (for example) Moses, David, Abraham or men as a whole.

    Thanks again for clarification.

    By the way..I watched again youtube just now. Is this man lying ?

    The man (Dr Jerald F. Dirks) was talking about Bible facts on The Deen Show. He said many “addition” to the Bible..which I’m sure enough of his ideas however. Please watch it yourself what people says about the Holy Bible (besides Bart Ehrman’s – probably an atheist).

    The title you need search on youtube ia: The Deen Show: Amazing Facts About The Bible ( or, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqcf-gOZEnY&features=related).

    Looking forward for your opinion.

  95. Scott Thong Says:

    Haha thanks for the compliment, but I’m sure the atheists commentors will disagree that I don’t get riled up.

    However I didn’t say Jesus was God – that would be even more deviated (by Muslim understanding). I said, that particular verse stated that “father” is meant for everyones..or the others – not for Jeus alone.

    I didn’t mean that you said Jesus was God – I already know you are Muslim, and so would never say or think such a thing! What I was explaining is that ‘the Father’ is not used for Jesus by Christians, as He is ‘the Son’.

    You are right that ‘Son of God’ is only used for Jesus according to Christianity. The reason that others are not called that is because they are ordinary humans. ‘Son of Man’ is another term used only for Jesus.

    However, ‘sons of God’ and ‘sons of man’ are similar terms that

    As I said, sometimes the only way to differentiate which term is being used is by the context. For example, if I say “We are all considered sons of God” I mean it in the sense that God is the heavenly Father and we are ‘adopted’ into His family. But if I say, “We obey the Son of God” then I mean Jesus, not just any human. (When I speak out those sentences, you won’t be able to see the capital letters.)

    For comparison, if you were to say “A prophet is not supposed to have sin” then I would quickly understand that you mean any prophet sent by God. Whereas if you say “The Prophet gave instructions for how to fast” I would understand that you are talking about Mohammad.

    On the Youtube, I must confess that I am usually too impatient to sit and listen through a video. I prefer to read the points quickly.

    So I will watch it later at some time (maybe), unless you would be so helpful as to list out what he says or link to a transcript…

  96. Nasaei Ahmad Says:

    Well, threre are a numbers of Youtube videos about this man’s on talkshow actually , just type “Youtube, Jerald F. Dirks”. One of them which I meant is:

  97. sylvi Says:

    JUSTIN U R THE FU***** AHOLE HERE….WHY DONT U MIND UR OWN SH*T AND STOP COMMENTING ON OTHER PEOPLE’S BELIEFS AND RELIGION,U SICK F***…..RAPE BABIES ARE STILL BABIES….AND WHAT ABOUT THE ONES THAT GET ABORTED CAUSE THE MOM FORGOT TO TAKE HER PILL OR THE DAD WAS TOO CHEAP TO BUY A CONDOM!!!???PARENTS HAVE THE RIGHT TO CHOOSE THE LIFE THE WANT FOR THEMSELVES BUT THE BABIES HAVE RIGHTS TOO…THEY ARE AFTER ALL,HUMANS TOO….!!!U R SUCH A DOUCHEBAG,HOW DARE U SAY THAT PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN RELIGION AND GOD ARE NUTJOBS???AND HOW DO U KNOW THAT GOD DOES’NT LOVE US,DID HE TELL YOU THAT AT THE TEA PARTY YOU INVITED HIM TO LAST NIGHT???DRESS UP AS ANYTHING YOU WANT,U R GONNA ROT IN HELL ANYWAY…I HOPE U NEVERRRRR HAVE KIDS,NO POOR BABY DESERVES A PARENT LIKE YOU!!!

    AND ONE MORE THING,IF YOUR MOM HAD GOTTEN AN ABORTION,A FAG LIKE YOU WOULD’NT BE HERE POSTING COMMENTS AND INSULTING OTHERS!!!THINK ABOUT IT….

  98. Elizabeth Says:

    90% of these posts come from the most ignorant group of people I have ever read. You really need to get your facts straight! I’ve worked in a hospital and dumping any sort of human product into the trash is a violation. Also most abortions are taken place between 8 and 12 wks. All your pictures are much later than that. How do you know that those pictures are real for one, and if the mother was even alive. It’s a HUMAN RIGHT for people to do what they want with their lives and their bodies. How dare you compare abortion to the horrible 911 and other holocausts. If a woman CHOOSES to have the baby or CHOOSE to give it up for adoption or CHOOSE to have the pregnancy terminated that is her right. I’m not at all angry with any of these ignorant comments because I know better. Until you walk in another persons shoes, you really just need to worry about your own life. You only live once, while fill your life and beliefs with such hatred towards others. Do something productive like teaching young people not to get themselves into a situation where they have to make a decision like this. Instead of sitting on here behind your computer screen acting like you are so special. Not sure how I came across this sight, but I must say, I felt compelled to leave my two cents. Since I so have better and more important things to do than this, I will end my rant now!

  99. Scott Thong Says:

    It’s a HUMAN RIGHT for people to do what they want with their lives and their bodies.

    So why are fetuses murdered without having any say in whether or not they want to live, or want their body not to be ripped apart with surgical scissors?

    You only live once, while fill your life and beliefs with such hatred towards others.

    Except for unwanted children who are killed before they are born.

    Do something productive like teaching young people not to get themselves into a situation where they have to make a decision like this.

    I do.

    http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2007/07/24/stop-free-love-casual-sex-is-killing-humanity/

    http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2008/09/12/abortion-is-the-con-choice/

  100. Simon Thong Says:

    Somehow, I don’t think your comments are worth two cents, Elizabeth..

  101. Ron Says:

    “The total rate of pregnancy loss after implantation, including clinically recognized spontaneous abortions, was 31 percent.”

    New England Journal of Medicine
    Volume 319:189-194
    July 28, 1988
    Number 4
    Incidence of early loss of pregnancy

    http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/abstract/319/4/189

    According to US stats on infant mortality there are:

    – 600,000+ miscarriages each year
    – 20,000+ still births each year.
    – 5,500+ deaths due to congenital defects
    – 4,500+ deaths due to pre-term births and low birth weight
    – 1,500+ deaths due to maternal complications
    – 1,000+ deaths due to umbilical cord and placenta complications
    – 2,500 infant deaths due to Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS)

    And worldwide, over 50,000 children die every day due to famine, undernourishment, and, disease.

    When it comes to baby killing, God (the perfect and moral absolutist) is still the number one abortionist in the world.

  102. Simon Thong Says:

    Your last paragraph, Ron, suggests that much as you disagree with God, your Creator, you still believe that He exists.

  103. Ron Says:

    Nah, I’m just framing the argument to fit the theist’s world view.

  104. Simon Thong Says:

    so you say, so you say..

  105. Ronan Says:

    Thank God for Welfare!!!

  106. killemall Says:

    I SAY IT IS BULLSH*T AND UR ALL N*GGERS ABOUT THIS PRO LIFE THING IF A HOMELES CUPPLE WANTS TO HAVE AN ABOURTON THAT GO FOR IT BETTER ITS DEAD THAN STARVING ON THE STREETS AND ON THE PLUS SIDE ITS GOOD POPULATION CONTROLE DO WE REALLY NEED MORE RETARDS IN THIS WOLD CUZ WE ALL KNOW WE HAVE ENUF OF THEM ALREADY SO LONG STORY SHORT IM WRITE UR WRONG SUCK IT MOTHER F*CKERS EAT SH*T AND GET ABORTED

  107. Scott Thong Says:

    Y’know killemall, it’s not too late for you to go self-abort if you really support it so much.

  108. jenn Says:

    @pass girl.. we have the same experience…

    im 19 yrs old…2nd yr college student,.. i dont want to get pregnant yet at my status…i want to finish college first so that i can help to my family..now,i got pregnant..i took PT, it was june 20..the last menstruation i have was on may 14..and the last sex i made was on may 23…and then i thought my baby was now 1 month. i told this to my four friends and to my boyfriend. my bf said: he’s not ready and i need to abort my baby. my friends tried to help me all about abortion because that’s what i want that day! but 1 month later, lots of medicine, bitter drinks i toke..the baby’s still in my tummy.. i told this to my auntie..(she’s in manila so im not really worried that she would tell it to my mom. july 28, i went home. (our province. FYI i studied far from our province.) when i got home, my mom knew it. ABORTION >that’s what i want at that time because of my studies.. so, my mom helped me. it was third time (the abortion process), and still the baby still in my tummy. my mom’s friend told me that it was a baby girl and really hard to get rid. she said nothing happened to the baby, the baby’s ok. then me and my mom decided not to continued to abort her. at that time, i was so excited and nervous. excited that i can already have my first baby and nervous if she’s really okay. i texted my friends that everything’s okay. but at night, when i was lying, i felt a liquid flowing down in my *****.. then i got worried..i was praying that it was not and hoping to stopped. but then the blood continued to flow down. in the morning, i felt really bad pain in my tummy and under my tummy. it was august 4. then at 4 o’clock, the tiny baby got out. she formed a real baby at all. God, forgive me. i really really do not know that a full formed fetus would got out from my womb. and i saw her! i saw my baby jam2x. i punched the wall of our comfort room. i really regret. i really do not know. my mom’s friend told me i was wrong on counting, the fetus was already 4 months. and that was i dont know because all i know is it was only 2 months.

    and now, im suffering. im crying most of the day. i always praying that my baby will come back. and every 4 o’clock, i lighted candle for my baby and at the same time praying for the forgiveness of our Lord God. i dont know if i can get over this. i really feel bad. really regretful. i love my baby. how i wish she’s here now in my tummy. (sigh)

    to my baby jam2x, wherever you are, i love you so much, i miss you so much, and be a good girl. after 4 years, i’ll make it sure you’ll be back. i love you.

    to the people who planned to abort their babies: please, dont do it. i know everything what’s on it and what can you feel right after. because i lerned lots of things from my big big mistakes.

    to our dearest Lord God… forgive me po. sorry of what i have done. i really do not know. i thought only blood will come out. please forgive me and please take good care of my baby jam2x.

  109. jenn Says:

    .

  110. still lost Says:

    i was 14 when i found out i was pregnant.. my foster mom told me i had to get one.. she made me believe it was the right thing to do.. she told me all kinds of lies.
    im 22 now and still wish i could go back and to it all over again. it is the worst thing i have ever done in my life. i know i will have to deal with that pain over and over again. sometimes i will still wake up at nights holding my tummy. i still can’t believe i let someone kill my baby.
    they are babies, humans. my baby had fingers. a face with eyes, nose, mouth.. she did not want to die..she wanted to go back were she new it was safe, bc even rape babies need to be loved. want to be loved for that matter.
    amber ,
    my little one mommy loves you so much. someday i will be with you again. i will show you how sorry i am. i cant wait to see your smile. love mommy

  111. Nostradamus Says:

    Sorry for off topic, but 2012 is close, is this really matter?

  112. Simon Thong Says:

    “There have also been several well-known internet hoaxes, where quatrains in the style of Nostradamus have been circulated by e-mail as the real thing. The best-known examples concern the collapse of the World Trade Center in the attacks of September 11, 2001, which led both to hoaxes and to reinterpretations by enthusiasts of several quatrains as supposed prophecies.” From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    No, 2012 does NOT matter.

  113. pamela Says:

    life is a gift from god!

  114. Ryan Henderson Says:

    Lets say, for example, a 15 year old girl gets raped. And she becomes pregnant with the rapists son/daughter. Are all of you anti-abortionist people going to say, “no you can’t have an abortion. You have to keep this child and raise it at age 15.”

    This girl is forced to quit school her freshman year in high school. She has to find some financial support. Her parents perhaps. But what if its all too much?

    People who make bad decisions as a couple should not get an abortion. They were irresponsible and that’s their own falt. But for those who are not given a choice. They should be allowed to make a choice. If you know what I mean…

  115. Scott Thong Says:

    That is an extreme scenario, just as ‘girl who repeatedly gets pregnant and aborts the fetus as a sick hobby’ is an extreme scenario. So it’s kind of a straw man argument.

    If you look past the caricatures drawn by pro-abortion advocates, you should find that most pro-lifers don’t want a blanket ban on abortions. We simply want sensible restrictions on it.

    So… No, we wouldn’t force the girl to keep the baby. Nor would we in cases of incest, life-threatening complications, etc. (Varies depending on the individual pro-lifer.)

    In the meantime, we say that people shouldn’t have abortions as a convenience. I mean, seriously – 1.5 million abortions per year in the USA alone??? How many rape, incest and life-threatening cases ARE there?!!! Use a condom, isn’t it cheaper and safer? What are all those condom-distribution-in-school campaigns for?

    Roe vs Wade skewed the whole concept of ‘danger to mother’s health’ by including ‘emotional distress’ as a danger to health. Hence, any woman can get an abortion simply by claiming she is unhappy with the pregnancy.

    So yes, I agree with your closing paragraph.

  116. Ryan Henderson Says:

    Lots of great points in your response Scott. I agree with you completely. I just wanted to be sure you weren’t in favor of making abortions illegal. As much as we all would like to forget those extreme cases, they do exist and they do happen. More often than they should. And my heart would go out to all the raped, violated, and mortified women who would be stuck with the memories, and in young women’s cases the inconvinence, that a child would bring to them.

    So as you said, regulation and restrictions. Yes

    Making abortions absolutely illegal. No

  117. Scott A Harrison Says:

    When I was @ 14 I wanted Shot my Momm & Staep DAD 12 Gauge >>

    Shot Gun > Then Set them Both On Fire in their Bed @ 15 I started Prcatcing ” BLACK – MGIC ” Staright from the GOD D*MN BIBLE >.
    What your Redaing Is a True Story >> Im age 48 Now and I would take a Bucther Knife and SLIT > My Mother Thraot from Ear to Ear >.
    Like that Nugger ( OJ ) and spit on the Ground WHY ???

    Becasue I was Beaten Day and Night That why ( SOB )

    Scott A harrison “F*ck Off ! “

  118. Joe the Plumber Says:

    Never understood why Christards are against abortion. You should be rejoicing ’cause according to your dogma all those unborn ‘babies’ die sinless and go straight to heaven. Hallelujah!!! Praise Jebus!!!

  119. aleesha vinchetti Says:

    I believe in God and I believe in peace, happiness, tranquility and all that other stuff. We get mad, shocked, upset and want to do something about it when there is a school shooting or someone gets stabbed on the streets. Why is it different about an abortion? So you mean to tell me we can stab an unborn child in the skull and suck out his brains and not do a thing because he’s only tissue he isnt really a human? we have people tweaking out because animals are being left outside but you want to tell me no one cares because it is only an animal? but when a shooting or stabbing takes place people throw tantrums? yeah that makes a lot of sense. at 11 weeks gestation a baby is breathing he has a heartbeat. even if you dont have a heart, that baby does. Tell me it’s not murder, but i will prove you wrong. when you abort a baby he/she may be the next rosa parks, john travolta, billy Graham or nathan morris. that child may be the one to discover the cure for cancer and you just aborted him so now you just screwed up the plan that God has. that baby will never see their first borthday, never go and play on the swings, never kiss someone or date never drive and never know they are loved. honestly if you dont want one dont have sex or at least do it the safe way. how would you feel if you were aborted? put yourself in the baby’s place. but its okay because Jesus will take care of them and when you go to the judgement seat and he asks you why you aborted the baby he gave you then you can give him the excuse it wasnt a baby it was only skin. that’s just my feelings on it.

  120. aleesha vinchetti Says:

    and there are other options like adoption. there are women that would love a baby and cant have one so youd make them happy. and in the case of a rape or something you are still going to have those memories-baby or not. you can give the baby up for adoption. just saying.

  121. Beka Says:

    with babies being such a miracle i could never wish this upon any other human being. before today i wasnt really concerned with aboration, thinking it was done prematurley to the fetus being developed but knowing that it is and was a complete gift from god tha tnever even had a cahnce to live. its like birthing a baby and immidiatly killing it, who would wish that upon any living person? it almost sickens me to think of the mothers expression if she saw this recently living human coming out of her yet there is no compassion whatsoever but you ahve to wonder for the people with such little compassion how oculd they possibly sufficeintly raise a child? but then there is adoption which would not only help a family in need of a child but get money to the original parent. such an intricate and perfect gift from god.. i dont see how anyone could put another living human through this process if they knew the abortionist would suck the brain out, crush the skull, cut and scrape the body parts all while it was living. its a sick an evil thing for anyone to ever dream of..

  122. Kana Says:

    Most abortion clinics don’t abort after 12 weeks are passed. Your pictures are all taken from questionable sources and appear as though the women aborted mere seconds away from delivery. Incidentally, your proclamations that “abortionists = murderers” does not seem very conducive to comforting or soothing the PASS sufferers in the comments or who may be reading this. Before you start preaching, why don’t you realize that your sick fascination with posting pictures of dismembered, crushed, or otherwise mutilated fetuses (or should I say “newborns”?) is far more macabre than the mental processes of any individual seeking an abortion.

  123. Scott Thong Says:

    This abortion clinic did it after 12 weeks, and I daresay the doctor in charge surpasses me in macabreness.

  124. Yuck Says:

    kana said: “Before you start preaching, why don’t you realize that your sick fascination with posting pictures of dismembered, crushed, or otherwise mutilated fetuses (or should I say “newborns”?) is far more macabre than the mental processes of any individual seeking an abortion”.

    That’s true. Trying to justify an obsession is a bit disturbing. Yuck.

  125. Simon Thong Says:

    There is no obsession. I don’t see such things plastered everywhere. Scott has a blog with many and diverse posts and themes, and I don’t see aborted foetuses in any of them?I think you are trying to evade the whole issue. What are you trying to deny?

    “What are your obsessions?” is a better question. For kana. For Yuck.

  126. Scott Thong Says:

    your sick fascination with posting pictures of dismembered, crushed, or otherwise mutilated fetuses

    Has anybody noticed that I didn’t post even a single of those pictures?

  127. Simon Thong Says:

    kana and Yuck. Seeing things? Seeing ghosts? Ghosts of aborted foetuses?

  128. kaiya Says:

    i had an abortion but my mother forced it on me, she told me if i didnt do it i was going to get put out of her house and have to find somewhere to live, and she was not going to help me so i had an abortion and now i really really really do regret it! I will never ever do it again! i was 7wks and 3days

  129. Scott Thong Says:

    My condolences kaiya… Make sure not to have premarital sex okay? Your future baby’s father must really love you enough to want to spend his life with you (and only you), marry you, and work hard for you and your children.

  130. Translated » Blog Archive » human fetus photo Says:

    [...] Pictures of Aborted Fetuses – They Look Human, They ARE Human … Jan 25, 2008 … 129 Responses to “Pictures of Aborted Fetuses – They Look Human, They ARE Human” … [...]

  131. god Says:

    your all morons abort yourselves and your children before you make the world stupid.its retarded to talk about it being a baby its sh*t in a flesh suit

  132. Temporarily» Blog Archive » Pictures of aborted babys Says:

    [...] Pictures of Aborted Fetuses – They Look Human, They ARE Human … Jan 25, 2008 … That if women are free to abort their babies on a whim, their whim might be to abort only baby girls … [...]

  133. Samantha Joanne White Says:

    As a mother of 2, I feel there is nothing wrong with abortion, I honestly think more people should have them. There’s a lot of horrible people out there that have no right to have children, and those kids end up being taken away and raised in foster homes. How is that better than an abortion

  134. Samantha Joanne White Says:

    And really, what about women that were raped, and got pregnant. I wouldn’t want to have that kid

  135. Scott Thong Says:

    Samantha, here’s how being raised in foster homes is better:

    One four-year study by the Search Institute in Minnesota found that adopted teenagers had greater empathy, higher self-esteem and more close friends than non-adopted teenagers in public schools, and were also less likely to engage in high-risk behavior, such as stealing and excessive drinking. In all, they scored higher than the control group on 16 indicators of well-being.

    Meanwhile, adopted kids, on average, turn out better than even biological kids raised in two-parent families.

    They’re too busy running Oracle (Larry Ellison), the District of Columbia (Anthony Williams), or fantastic political websites, like “Big Government” (Andrew Breitbart).

    CASEY ANTHONY: SINGLE MOM OF THE YEAR!

    Seriously, are you saying that it’s better to kill a baby than let it have a chance at life – even if it’s a lousy life? Do you know how many people in abject poverty and constant suffering still fight on just to cling to precious life one more day?

    You are basically saying “Because the kids’ parents are lousy, let’s kill the kid.” Who decides which parents are lousy? If it were my authority and I decided you would make a lousy parent, how would you feel if I took away your children to be executed? That’s hardcore Communist statism right there!

    As for rape cases, please realize that the actual position of most opponents of abortion is that abortion should only be done in extreme cases – such as rape, incest, or life-threatening complications.

    Instead, modern legalized abortion is most often simply for the sake of convenience. Can’t people use condoms, for crying out loud?

    There are literally a million abortions a month worldwide! Can you tell me that a majority of these are due to extreme cases?

  136. Ron Says:

    Foster care is not the same as adoption. And while it’s true that adopted children can lead normal and productive lives, the study referred to also stressed the following:

    We cannot overstate the power of early placement. It is likely a key ingredient in the successful attachment of child to parent (and vice versa). And such attachment, which is strong among the vast majority of families in this study, is an important precursor to positive identity and psychological health, both of which are commonplace among the adolescents in this study.

    Can’t people use condoms, for crying out loud?

    According to the stats, teen pregnancy rates are highest in the Bible belt states, where parents teach abstinence only and condom use is never discussed or discouraged outright.

    Even sadder, the same religious organizations which condemn condom use, sex education and abortion routinely deny willing couples the right to adopt.

  137. Scott Thong Says:

    According to the stats, teen pregnancy rates are highest in the Bible belt states, where parents teach abstinence only and condom use is never discussed or discouraged outright.

    Does this count teen pregnancies which were terminated by abortion and not reported to the parents of the teen?

  138. Ron Says:

    I don’t know, but in some cases this would appear to be a moot point.

    Incest: in many parts of the Bible Belt, the most popular form of dating. ~Chaz Bufe

    Then again, the Bible does not explicitly prohibit sexual relations between a man and his daughter(s).

  139. Ron Says:

    Then there’s this story:

    A New Jersey man whose apocalyptic visions allegedly led him to rape his five daughters and terrorize his family for years was found guilty Wednesday of sexually assaulting a daughter who testified that she bore him a child.

    [...]

    The man’s former wife and daughter also testified that he spoke of being a prophet who believed in keeping his bloodlines pure. [...]

    Guess Jesus was right when he said, “A prophet is honored everywhere except in his own hometown and among his relatives and his own family.”

    Those “gosh-darn” liberal jurists and the judge who sentenced this devout man of God to prison are clearly anti-Christian.

  140. Scott Thong Says:

    Absolutely correct. Those amateurs ought to know that the prescribed punishment for incest, rape, false prophecy and adulterous sex outside of marriage is a community stoning session.

  141. Ron Says:

    But as I already pointed out two comments ago, the Bible does not explicitly prohibit sexual relations between a man and his daughter(s) — see Leviticus 20 (handy chart for what’s okay and what isn’t) and Genesis 19:32-36 — so this is not a case of incest.

    Nor is this a case of adultery, because his daughter wasn’t “another man’s wife” at the time (Lev. 20:10).

    And the prescription for rape is given in Deuteronomy 22:25-29:

    25 But if out in the country a man happens to meet a young woman pledged to be married and rapes her, only the man who has done this shall die. 26 Do nothing to the woman; she has committed no sin deserving death. This case is like that of someone who attacks and murders a neighbor, 27 for the man found the young woman out in the country, and though the betrothed woman screamed, there was no one to rescue her.

    28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.

    So, since his daughter was not pledged to another, the correct punishment would be to pay himself 50 shekels and then marry her.

    As for false prophecy, how can you be sure?

  142. Scott Thong Says:

    But as I already pointed out two comments ago, the Bible does not explicitly prohibit sexual relations between a man and his daughter(s)

    That’s a good observation, but Lev 18:6 already covers close relations in general, and 18:17 covers ‘both a woman and her daughter’ specifically.

    So, since his daughter was not pledged to another, the correct punishment would be to pay himself 50 shekels and then marry her.

    First we would need to convene the Sanhendrin in order to judge the case and pass verdict… If indeed the accused is known to be a practising Jew.

    As for false prophecy, how can you be sure?

    For that matter, how do we tell from the article if he was not a self-declared prophet of Baal, Quetzcoatl or Woden?

  143. Ron Says:

    That’s a good observation, but Lev 18:6 already covers close relations in general, and 18:17 covers ‘both a woman and her daughter’ specifically.

    Yes, but remains mute about a man and his daughter — a rather strange omission in light of the other explicit prohibitions.

    First we would need to convene the Sanhendrin in order to judge the case and pass verdict… If indeed the accused is known to be a practising Jew.

    Hey, you brought up the issue, i.e. prescribed OT punishments.

    But I’m flexible. If your argument is that these were Jewish Laws, then I’m entirely exempt from the Abrahamic Cvenant, since I’m neither Jewish by race or conversion. The only rules I’m bound by are the one’s God gave Noah in Genesis 9:1-16 — and I’m proud to say, “all these commands have I kept.”

  144. Ron Says:

    “For that matter, how do we tell from the article if he was not a self-declared prophet of Baal, Quetzcoatl or Woden?”

    Not from that one. But there are numerous articles on the internet which identify him and his religious beliefs. And had he thanked (Baal, Quetcoatl, Woden) “for making this award possible” during the live broadcast of his acceptance speech, I’m pretty certain it would have made the headlines.

  145. Scott Thong Says:

    Yes, but remains mute about a man and his daughter — a rather strange omission in light of the other explicit prohibitions. – Ron

    Umm, if by that you mean boofing both a man and his daughter, I’m pretty sure the stone-homosexuals-to-death passages apply.

    Hey, you brought up the issue, i.e. prescribed OT punishments.

    I AM SUPER CEREAL ABOUT THAT.

  146. Ron Says:

    Actually, I was thinking of righteous Lot (2 Peter 2:7) , the homeless widower who banged his daughters after going on a couple of all-night benders. The rule in Leviticus 18:17 only covers sleeping with a mother AND her daughter, but in this situation, mommy was no longer alive. And considering that there’s no biblical restriction against two women getting it on, one could argue that it’s entirely permissible for a woman to do both dad and his biological daughter with impunity.

    As to homosexuality, one might ask: what exactly does “Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman” really mean? Since anatomical differences already prevent coitus with another man the rule seems to be completely unnecessary.

  147. Scott Thong Says:

    Actually, I was thinking of righteous Lot (2 Peter 2:7) , the homeless widower who banged his daughters after going on a couple of all-night benders.

    I’ve been meaning to address this oft-repeated snark of yours.

    Lot’s mention as righteous and a ‘hero of faith’ (Hebrews 11) refers not to whatever wrong he did, but rather focuses on the right that they did – for Hebrews 11, namely simply believing that fire was about to melt the town and running for the hills, despite the local weather forecast being ‘sunny with light breezes, suitable for picnicking in the town square’.

    To use a modern example: When liberals lionize Ted Kennedy, do they make sure to always mention his gnarly new sport of Synchronized Oldsmobile Surfing (Doubles)? /snark

    Heck, every single Biblical human character has his or her flaws – because they are fallen and inescapably prone to sin, which is a basic Christian teaching.

    Besides, it was the daughters who drugged him up and non-consensual intercoursed him. And as I mentioned often before, the end result was two sets of die-hard enemies of Abraham’s family tree.

    And considering that there’s no biblical restriction against two women getting it on, one could argue that it’s entirely permissible for a woman to do both dad and his biological daughter with impunity.

    As to homosexuality, one might ask: what exactly does “Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman” really mean? Since anatomical differences already prevent coitus with another man the rule seems to be completely unnecessary.

    See, I’ve noticed that oftimes, Bible-bashing polemicists get to the point where their arguments start to sound like they were constructed by an alien race comprised entirely of contract linguistic lawyers who have utterly no experience living in human society with its incomprehensibly human notion of ‘common sense’.

    How else do we explain overly legalistic and literal interpretations as the above, or not comprehending the existence of metaphors before TV sitcoms were invented?

  148. Ron Says:

    I’ve been meaning to address this oft-repeated snark of yours.

    Last time you bowed out of the convo.

    Lot’s mention as righteous and a ‘hero of faith’ (Hebrews 11) refers not to whatever wrong he did, but rather focuses on the right that they did – for Hebrews 11, namely simply believing that fire was about to melt the town and running for the hills, despite the local weather forecast being ‘sunny with light breezes, suitable for picnicking in the town square’.

    So getting the hell out of Dodge is now classified as righteous behavior? Even if that were true, your exegesis is severely flawed. Because in verse 16 we read that Lot hesitates and the angels had to grab Lot and his family by the hand and lead them out of the city. Then Lot beseeches them to let him flee to the nearest town because he’s afraid he’ll die before reaching the mountains — hardly the characteristics of someone who exudes a great deal of faith or confidence.

    Heck, every single Biblical human character has his or her flaws – because they are fallen and inescapably prone to sin, which is a basic Christian teaching.

    Right. First Lot moves to “sin city” and takes up permanent residence. He even makes arrangements to marry his daughters off to the local gang-bangers. On the eve of destruction, he offers to pass those same daughters out as sexual party favors to an unruly mob outside his door with a quaint offer to “do what you like with them.” Later, once he’s safely out of harms way, he gets drunk and impregnates them in a cave. Those represent some serious character flaws for a so-called “righteous” man, wouldn’t you say?

    Besides, it was the daughters who drugged him up and non-consensual intercoursed him. And as I mentioned often before, the end result was two sets of die-hard enemies of Abraham’s family tree.

    Judge: Lot, you stand accused of sexually molesting and impregnating your two teenage daughters.

    Lot: Your Honor, those little strumpets got me drunk and seduced me. In fact, I was passed out when it happened.

    Judge: Lot, studies have shown that drunkenness is no excuse for sex with a minor — especially for a middle-aged man who beds his own daughters. Besides, do you really expect me to believe a comatose man can get it up?

    See, I’ve noticed that oftimes, Bible-bashing polemicists get to the point where their arguments start to sound like they were constructed by an alien race comprised entirely of contract linguistic lawyers who have utterly no experience living in human society with its incomprehensibly human notion of ‘common sense’.

    Incomprehensible is an apt description for the mambo-jumbo contained within the Bible. And if common sense were an innate human notion, the why the need for a divine guidebook?

  149. Dog Training Boston Says:

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  150. Mandy Says:

    We only have one child, she is 5 years old and she is our angel, she took a long time to come into my husband and my life. she is our everything.

    If you have had an abortion, you have murdered. If you are contemplating an abortion than you should commit suicide because you will never live a life knowing that you killed a baby. So put a gun to your head and blow your brains out. You are stupid, you are not worth life itself. Don’t give excuses to help yourself commit a murder. I’m too broke, my boyfriend doesn’t want, we are too young. When you opened your legs it was nice, I say your stupid because we are not living in the dark ages, if you did not have safe sex then possibly you will land up H.I.V. A burden to your family and society. God is not going to help you.

    To the idiot women who hates babies, ya, your a waste of oxygen someone should put you out of your misery. How can you hate something so pure, so innocent, so sweet. Your a very sick women. i wouldn’t have a problem putting a bullet in your head and to the little girl who says that killing babies is fun. You are the devil’s child, perhaps your mother kept the after birth and threw the baby away. Or you are an abortion that went wrong. You are a sick sick little girl and some lead in the head will sort you.

    Do not bring religion into abortion. Because Jehovah God is Love and he has given you his word in the bible. You will be punished for your sins, just as a father disaplines his child, you will pay for your sins.

    To any pregnant girl before you end your life with abortion, think first, all the stories that you read, only at the end they regret. You stupid stupid useless little ******* think before you open your legs. Today its a baby tomorrow it WILL BE A DEATH SENTENCE FOR YOU. HAPPY HIV and AIDS…

    I challenge any idiot about to have an abortion to contact me, I will glady have their baby. BEFORE THEY MURDER THE LITTLE ONE.

  151. Maura Says:

    Justin Says:
    October 31, 08 at 4:42 am

    You people are so f*cking closed minded, Dictating how other people should live there life. Shut the f*ck up worry about your own life. What about Victims of Rape? They should keep the baby just to keep your god happy right… Give me a f*cking break. Stupid religious nut jobs. God doesn’t Love you. And your religion is a rip off of bunch a peigan religions. And just for you aholes im gona be an abortionist for Halloween
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Justin dear your imbecile comments are well noted. It would be you with the closed mind.

    I have a friend from college who was brutally raped by 3 football players back in the 1980’s. One of them got her pregnant that night. She is agnostic and choose to keep her baby.

    Your religious nut job theory is a wild one, although it makes me wonder with all the hate you have for a diety you don’t believe in how you clearly have a tormented mind and wouldn’t be surprised if you eventually take your rage out on another human being. Then again, when people LOVE to shed blood like you do eventually you want to taste it too

    Clearly Justin, you have great respect and love people who brutally and savagely tear a precious human baby from its mothers womb piece by piece, then crush it’s head with a medical instrument, and then suck the lifeless flesh and blood dead human being baby from the mothers womb in a vacuum? And you have the brazen stupidity to call people who protest these murders closed minded? You are a bonifide mind-controlled quack!

    My friend raised a healthy baby boy. He is now 27 with a wife and two children. She is a grandmother with a wonderful daughter-in-law. She valued life and the future that life would bring to her.

    Supporting the killing of babies is the epitome of a person who is closed-minded, cold-hearted and unable to comprehend the impact of life and the future. These mind-controlled freaks are so caught up in their desire to dictate who should live they can’t see past their own noses because it is YOU Justin who is dictating IF another human being should life when you are a coward supporting human genocide that first starts with the killing of innocent babies.

    Mark my words Justin human genocide is coming fast and furious to this world by the government you adore and support in its baby-killing factory. YOU Justin despite your support for baby genocide may be the next target for population control. What goes around comes around.

  152. Scott Thong Says:

    Epic reply, Maura

  153. Catherine C. Says:

    Have you thought about the logistics of restricting abortion to cases of rape, incest, threat to the mother, and whatnot? I just don’t see how it could work.

    How would a woman prove she’s been raped? Would doctors just take her word for it? Or would they need a police report? Or would they need proof of conviction? By the time the case gets to trial, the baby might be 2 or 3 years old. But that’s assuming the victim had the guts to even report the rape in the first place: In 1992, a whopping 84% of rapes went unreported. More recently, RAINN announced that out of every 100 rapes, only 46 get reported, 12 lead to arrest, 9 get prosecuted, 5 lead to felony conviction, and only 3 out of 100 rapists spend any time in jail. And let’s not forget the close scrutiny that a woman’s character goes under during a rape trial. So many people blame the victim, you know. Taking an example from recent news, think of all the girls at Amherst College who were persecuted for being raped. Or this woman, who did get pregnant after a so-called “legitimate” rape and decided to keep the baby: http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/22/opinion/prewitt-rapist-visitation-rights/index.html. (Did you know that in 31 states, rapists can legally claim visitation rights or even custody of the children produced by their rape?)

    The same goes for incest. How would the victim prove that? And how much shame will she have to endure during the process? DNA tests via chorionic villus sampling isn’t even possible until approximately the 10th week after conception, and even then, doctors do not recommend it.

    On the flip side, if we do restrict abortion rights, I predict the number of false rape reports will go up exponentially, ruining the reputations of many innocent men–and that’s coming from a feminist who likes to take people at their word.

    In cases where the fetus threatens the life of the mother: Will there be an inquest every time a doctor terminates a pregnancy to make sure the doctor hasn’t performed some underhanded abortion? What if a doctor decides *not* to save the mother, in fear of losing his license? Then that’s two lives lost, not one.

    I know that’s a more extreme example, but I’m just making a point: that maybe we should leave things the way they are!

    Just some stuff to think about…

  154. Scott Thong Says:

    Thanks for the thoughts… I had never really considered the logistics especially with regard to the limiting time factor, especially if abortion is restricted to the first trimester.

    I suppose they could take a middle-line approach to it – for example, the woman can undergo an abortion while the case is being tried, with the caveat of penalties if it is later proven that she lied about it.

    The flip side is, at present, many underage rape (or statutory rape) cases are not reported by abortion providers.

    All this is compared to the existing ‘way things are’, which is actually almost at the very far left end of the pro/anti abortion spectrum – namely, that women can get an abortion for any and every reason they choose.

    In practice, how many of the roughly 100,000 abortions in America monthly (and the 125,000 worldwide abortions daily) are due to anything other than mere whim?

    It’s almost 100/0 on the rights of the woman vs the baby. To cite a common pro-life argument: Even in rape cases, what did the baby do that it deserves to die?

    Or to stretch the analogy further – if a mother found out today that her now-adult son was actually the product of a rape that she was totally unaware of (due to that drunken night in Vegas), does she have similar rights to ‘abort’ him? What would he say to that argument?

  155. Catherine C. Says:

    It is an insult to women to say that abortions are done on a “mere whim.” Do you really, honestly, think that women take this decision lightly?

    You might want to know that nearly half of all worldwide abortions each year (20 million of 46 million) are performed illegally. Before Roe v. Wade, hospitals had to devote entire wards to abortion recovery. Do you really want to go back to that? I know technology has improved so much that infections and other complications won’t occur nearly as often, but we all know that illegal surgical procedures rarely, if ever, follow proper protocol, and non-surgical abortions account for only 13% of induced abortions in the US. In other words, my reasoning is they’re gonna do it anyway, why not make it safe?

    Your middle-line approach to rape is a bit flawed. It assumes the woman will report her rape and press charges. More than half never get reported. On college campuses the number is even higher: an estimated 95% go unreported, according to the Justice Department. And if the woman doesn’t report her rape until after she finds out she’s pregnant, she’ll have a hard time getting the police to believe she was raped.

    Re your Vegas-rape analogy, it’s a straw man argument and not a plausible scenario. Legally, the son has more rights once he’s born. Everyone, regardless of whether or not they agree if a fetus is a human being, will agree that it’s murder to “abort” a “now-adult son.”

    I never said that the baby did anything to deserve to die. But then again, neither do the 55 to 65% of all conceptions who are spontaneously aborted in the first few days or weeks of a pregnancy, nor do the additional 10-15% who are miscarried later on. (And yes, I know they’re different because God let them happen; in abortions we’re playing God. But that doesn’t erase the fact that those poor 55-65% didn’t do anything to deserve the hand they were dealt.) On the flip side, what did the woman do that she deserved to have her entire life derailed by this rape? It’s dehumanizing her all over again when you force her to carry her rapist’s child if she doesn’t want to. Personally, I am pro-life, but I wouldn’t dream of forcing my morals onto other people, so I am pro-choice for others. Plus, I’m afraid that if we continue putting restrictions on abortions, the people who really need them won’t be able to get them.

    If you need an example of why I think things should stay “the way they are,” without adding any more restrictions to the ones we already have, just look at what happened to this woman because of the “partial birth abortion ban:”

    http://www.msmagazine.com/summer2004/womanandherdoctor.asp#martha

    Statistics about abortion don’t tell you what these women’s stories are. So please, don’t judge or demonize people you don’t know.

  156. Scott Thong Says:

    It is an insult to women to say that abortions are done on a “mere whim.” Do you really, honestly, think that women take this decision lightly?

    Forgive my poor and very insensitive choice of words.

    What I meant to say was that the overwhelming majority of women who choose to have an abortion do not do it for the ‘extreme cases’ that are so often used to gotcha Conservatives like Todd Akin – e.g. pregancies from rape, life-threatening, incest etc.

    And farbeit for me to judge on the factors that cause any particular individual woman to decide on having an abortion, but the statistics are clear:

    1% of all abortions occur because of rape or incest; 6% of abortions occur because of potential health problems regarding either the mother or child, and 93% of all abortions occur for social reasons (i.e. the child is unwanted or inconvenient). – http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/fastfacts.html

    25.9% Want to postpone childbearing.
    21.3% Cannot afford a baby
    14.1% Has relationship problem or partner does not want pregnancy
    12.2% Too young; parent(s) or other(s) object to pregnancy
    10.8% Having a child will disrupt education or job
    7.9% Want no (more) children
    3.3% Risk to fetal health
    2.8% Risk to maternal health
    2.1% Other

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_the_United_States#Reasons_for_abortions

    ——————————

    You might want to know that nearly half of all worldwide abortions each year (20 million of 46 million) are performed illegally. Before Roe v. Wade, hospitals had to devote entire wards to abortion recovery. Do you really want to go back to that? I know technology has improved so much that infections and other complications won’t occur nearly as often, but we all know that illegal surgical procedures rarely, if ever, follow proper protocol, and non-surgical abortions account for only 13% of induced abortions in the US. In other words, my reasoning is they’re gonna do it anyway, why not make it safe?

    Nirvana fallacy.

    http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index.php/logical-fallacies/135-nirvana-fallacy

    Why have anti-drug laws, ban on prostitution, border control, crime laws, any restrictions at all really?

    It might help if people would just use preemptive prevention instead of postemptive abortion. Far simpler than ripping out flesh and bone from a living body no?

    But then again, teen sex education doesn’t actually reduce the number of pregnancies, probably same goes for state-sponsored birth control.

    —————————–

    Your middle-line approach to rape is a bit flawed. It assumes the woman will report her rape and press charges. More than half never get reported. On college campuses the number is even higher: an estimated 95% go unreported, according to the Justice Department. And if the woman doesn’t report her rape until after she finds out she’s pregnant, she’ll have a hard time getting the police to believe she was raped.

    This is all assuming of course that there is no downside to having unrestricted abortions. Pro-lifers would object on that point.

    —————————–

    Re your Vegas-rape analogy, it’s a straw man argument and not a plausible scenario. Legally, the son has more rights once he’s born. Everyone, regardless of whether or not they agree if a fetus is a human being, will agree that it’s murder to “abort” a “now-adult son.”

    Straw man only according to pro-abortion advocates. Many pro-lifers consider the value of a human life to be the same whether it is one day before, one day after or 20 years after whichever trimester is legal.

    Funny thing isn’t it… Cross a state line or ask two different people (even two pro-abortion people) and suddenly a 20-week-and-one-day baby ‘not a human life’ becomes ‘now a human life’.

    —————————–

    I never said that the baby did anything to deserve to die.

    Never accused you in particular of that. But it was to raise the point that (to pro-lifers) the woman is not the sole stakeholder in an abortion.

    ————————-

    On the flip side, what did the woman do that she deserved to have her entire life derailed by this rape?

    Yes, but see, it’s almost always argued from this point of view and not with a focus – nary an afterthought! – to the stake of the baby.

    ————————-

    Personally, I am pro-life, but I wouldn’t dream of forcing my morals onto other people, so I am pro-choice for others.

    Two points on this.

    First, ofttimes abortion is compared to slavery: e.g. ‘Everyone who supported slavery was free, everyone who supports abortion was born’. Another similarity is that by your line of reasoning, the Union shouldn’t have forced its morals on the Confederacy.

    Second, every policy is the imposition of the views/morals/beliefs of some over the differing opinions of others. Keynesian economics rankles Austrian school proponents, drug laws infringe on the needs of medical marijuana users, and so on.

    ————————-

    Plus, I’m afraid that if we continue putting restrictions on abortions, the people who really need them won’t be able to get them.

    Even just the barest of restrictions? Because really, that is all I’m suggesting here. I am one of the least extreme pro-lifers you’ll probably find who calls himself a neocon.

    ————————-

    If you need an example of why I think things should stay “the way they are,” without adding any more restrictions to the ones we already have, just look at what happened to this woman because of the “partial birth abortion ban:”

    http://www.msmagazine.com/summer2004/womanandherdoctor.asp#martha

    Statistics about abortion don’t tell you what these women’s stories are. So please, don’t judge or demonize people you don’t know.

    Ah, what was that old quote again?

    “A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic.”

    What about what happened to each and every single young individual who was aborted? What of their stories? What of their stories? They are not demonized of course – merely ignored, cast aside (literally), voiceless.

  157. Cindy Says:

    All living beings have the right to live their natural life free and happy! Murder is unconditional so if you choose to eat the flesh of murdered animals you are participating in murder just as well. So remember that when you practice hypocrisy to suggest that one life is more important than another. Human’s have a choice to either participate in Saving or Murdering what are you doing with your precious human life?

  158. Scott Thong Says:

    Well personally I don’t hold that human life and nonhuman life are of equal intrinsic value. Call me a religious nut.

    But I have said that to the irreligious, Why is Animal Rape Wrong, But Animal Slavery-Imprisonment-Murder Okay?

  159. katie Says:

    murder murder murder im 25 weeks pregnant and having a girl and I love her your all sick

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