Wow Such Divine, So Council

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WLC & MSH: ROMANS 5 ON ADAM’S IMPUTED GUILT

William Lane Craig: Rather the doctrine says that I am guilty for what Adam did, that I am punishable, I am liable to punishment because of what Adam did. His guilt is imputed to all of his posterity. I’ve argued that that’s not the best interpretation of either Genesis 3 – none of the curses on Adam and Eve is about such imputation of guilt or sin – nor does Paul describe that in Romans 5. Rather what Paul says in Romans 5 is that death spread to all men because all men sinned. – https://www.reasonablefaith.org/media/reasonable-faith-podcast/listener-questions-about-new-book-on-adam

Michael S. Heiser: Now, follow my thinking here: 5:12 death (not guilt) passes to ALL humans – https://drmsh.com/romans-512-and-universalism-applying-my-take-on-romans-512-to-the-problem/

See also: Subsets of Condemnation & Justification and Do Babies Who Die Go to Heaven? Some Responses (Heiser’s take on it)

WHEN YOUR REFORMED BRAIN-GEARS GRIND TO A SCREECHING HALT BECAUSE OF YOUR OWN CALVINISTIC ILLOGIC

Hughes had a nicely packaged opening statement, but from 28:55 when Flowers asks a simple question about ‘Regeneration precedes faith’ you see how the Reformed position immediately ties itself into knots trying to reconcile its philosophical presuppositions!

Reciting confessional statements is easy, being forced to actually stop and think about what you just affirmed is hard. (By contrast, a non-Calvinist just simply says what the Bible plainly states: “Believe and have new life, faith precedes regeneration!”)

29:52 Flowers: “Regeneration or getting being reborn, given new life and you said yes. So that means somebody has to be born again given new life in order to come to Jesus, so they would have to have life before they have Jesus. And I’m asking, how does somebody have life apart from Christ?”

30:26 Hughes: “When we talk about this in in sort of a, a Reformed sort of a context”

30:50 Hughes: “I mean it’s, it’s difficult for us to say, really, that all of those things happen in a particular sequence… Uh, it’s really quite mysterious to us when it comes down to it. All that we know is that this is a work that God has done, we don’t affect it, God is the one who does”

31:24 Flowers” “Even the one you read earlier, John 20:31, by believing we may have life… It seems you get the order backwards, you say, well you have to have life in order to believe, and the Bible seems to say no, you believe so as to be given new life.”

31:37 Hughes: “Well it’s a good argument, uh but the, the uh, regenerating work that is done by God in a person’s heart is not the everlasting life, the everlasting life that we have in Christ is by faith. But that, the person’s spirit was dead and could not believe in Jesus until the work of the Father that is done on that person’s heart. So it is only through that regenerative work that we have life in Christ.”

32:10 Hughes: “Again it’s the, the order of events is difficult for us to fathom or to understand”

32:26 Flowers: “You are given life before you have life?”

32:32 Hughes: “Uh that’s, that’s uh, complex, it’s complicated, most certainly, well, um”